It’s been far too long since I voted FOR a president (playing defense by voting for someone in order to vote AGAINST another does not count). My No Party Affiliation status kept me from voting FOR Bernie in the primary, but had he won the nomination I would have walked miles on his behalf from doorbell to doorbell. Bernie 2020!
There is entirely too much savior-worship borne of the oh-so-USAn cult-of-the-individual in this piece.
All durable progressive change comes from vigorous mass movements where everybody get’s involved - not crying out for some messiah to save us.
Sure, Bernie is a great guy - but rather than grovel and plead for him to save us (by himself he can’t even begin to), we need to re-learn these things called “organizing” and “solidarity”. Until we do, things are hopeless.
Dear RoseAnn De Moro: YES, YES, YES, YES, YES, YES, YES, YES, YES, YES and YES, to all 11 things you listed. Thank you and you said it so well. : )
I know that all the things Senator Sanders ‘says’ sound pretty good, but actions speak louder than words.
When the time came to draw swords and stand our ground, the Senator urged surrender. He single-handedly destroyed the 'movement he had gotten into motion.
His support for Clinton is an albatross he will carry for a long time. A lot of people who were his most enthusiastic and passionate supporters will have a hard time ever trusting him again.
He wants us to elect him to lead us in a struggle against the most formidable power structure that has ever existed?..But when crunch time came, when passionate words demanded bold and committed ACTION, ole Bern tip-toed on out the back.
I’m just not sure that the good senator is ever going to live that down.
I agree with you and @Yunzer that hero worship is not enough and can get in the way of what we need - a much wider base of progressive voters, politicians, movements, etc.
Flat out lie is too strong though. “More Peaceful Tomorrows and a Less Militaristic Foreign Policy” doesn’t mean that Bernie’s ideas (let alone what he can actually accomplish assuming we are stuck with either a majority or almost a majority of Republicans in the senate) will immediately mean the US will get it right (following all UN rules w.r.t. military actions and not bully other countries in other ways either) in his first year in office. She used the words more and less and having heard one the main foreign policy speech RoseAnn DeMoro linked to, I have to agree (I wish he gave that speech in the primary though). And I don’t think anybody else in the field will do better (though I have no idea what ideas on foreign policy Castro has and if someone like Barbara Lee announces, I’ll retract that statement). And I don’t think there is a chance in hell that it woun’t be a D or an R winning in 2020. Go ahead and push back with examples (I know of several myself), but if you honestly think he isn’t an improvement I don’t know how to discuss this with you.
I couldn’t ageee more with RoseAnn DeMoro. Bernie is the only potential candidate who would generate such YUUUGE organic support, as there will be a groundswell of passion once he announces. TPTB will generate endless vile propaganda against him, about how he’s “not even a Democrat, he’s a self-hating Jew, he’s a socialist who wants to take all your money, he’s a sexist, he doesn’t relate to POCS”, etc. It will be tough to withstand, but withstand it we will because the alternative is continuation of the status quo, which is: unsustainable climate change, record wealth and income inequality, 30 million Americans without health insurance, 42 million underinsured, record homelessness, decreasing life expectancy, increasing child mortality rates, and rising poverty. Bernie Will Win!!
Sometimes, that is the right answer.
You might get that impression from reading comments here, but I don’t talking to relatively pro-Bernie people I know. I’m sure he will have plenty of supporters to get started and he doesn’t have nearly the hurdle of name recognition to get over that he had in 2016. Unless I see some polling data that your thoughts represent the average supporter who is willing to give money and volunteer time, I will continue to believe my assessment outside this forum.
Of course you need mass movements for change, but you need people with power to push those changes through. Latin America had mass movements for decades, but no one in power gave a damn until recently. And many of those countries are back to a situation where there are mass movements, with those in government who not only don’t care, but will beat those movements back violently. Right now, on issue after issue, people want one thing and the state does the exact opposite. Studies show the high correlation between what those with money and power want and what the state does, and the non-existent correlation between what the general population wants and the state does. On some issues that should be easy, say background checks for some firearms, there is over 90% support and the state does nothing. It isn’t hero worship to trust Bernie more than alternatives, because those alternatives haven’t done nearly as much as he has to earn that trust. Power matters, who you give that power to matters, and unless we replace this republic with a democracy, who in government you give power to will have huge impact as to whether or not things get done.
Yes, people have been fighting for single payer for a long time. It has had support from large segments of the population in the past, and nothing happened, now did it? People have been trying to organize unions in places like the South, as unions continue to disappear. Lots of social movements organized against the Iraq War, didn’t make an ounce of difference here, in Spain or the UK. Lots of activism, and yet things continued to get progressively worse, and the state continued to drift to the right (which continues). If this logic were true, if it really didn’t matter who was in government, then social movements could force Trump to adopt single payer and to do the radical changes needed to deal with the environmental crisis? Let’s not be silly. Yeah, social movements are needed, but so are people in power that agree with those social movements or are at least willing to bend to them. If that logic were true, then it really wouldn’t matter if Clinton or Sanders won, or if the state was filled with people like AOC versus the state filled with people like Joe Crowley. It also isn’t hero worship to acknowledge qualitative differences either. I am not indifferent to Beto, Harris or Booker versus Bernie, and no other logical leftist should be either.
It’s one thing to argue that voting for Bernie is sufficient for change to happen, or that we vote for him and he will wave a magic wand and everything gets better. It’s another to pretend it doesn’t matter who we give power to. We also could acknowledge that even if we voted in Bernie, he too might have to be challenged at times.
he has no magic want and never claimed he did but I remember when it first struck me that he could and should run for president back in 2010 when he was the ONLY Senate voice to filibuster against the changes being called for by the likes of Obama that would have hurt so many of us. Go back and watch it. He keeps moving the damn dems to the left and now that he has comrades in the House, things are looking better. He is not in this by himself, up to us to push even harder to make things happen. Here in California we are about to see a new MEDICARE FOR ALL single payer bill put forward next month. Bernie has helped make this a major issue nationwide. It has been on our table here in California since the late 90’s. Now we have a governor who might be willing to go all the way but we need to push him into the race. It is always about what WE do, not just one candidate fighting our fight all alone. I trust Bernie’s judgement and had he not come forward and remain out there talking about these issues since the 2016 campaign, the likes of our new representatives in the house, would never have happened. Many took heart and saw that you can come forward and win if you really give a damn and speak truth to power. GO BERNIE but also go SHERROD BROWN. Another progressive doing his best against the odds and winning in a very right state of OHIO, in spite of his democratic progressive credentials.
Quick, give me a person on the left that has a larger impact on moving policy, changing the political center of gravity and inspiring people to run more than him. Give me another person on the left that has a chance to win (a better chance to win), that will be more likely to push changes through. There are plenty of logical critiques of Sanders that he should respond to. He isn’t great on foreign policy. His single payer bill is far inferior to HR 676. But would the logical critiques of the alternatives not be much more substantial?
This is the 1,000,000,000th example of the left potentially shooting itself in the foot. We have never had anyone like Sanders in the White House, maybe Henry Wallace before he turned to the right later in life. To think that we could vote for Sanders but then not do so for these types of reasons is insane.
Of course I’ll take Brown over a Republican in Ohio or as president but I’ve heard him a few times and wouldn’t put him in the same set as Bernie. He’s pretty timid on Single Payer too - from Wikipedia (and I heard him somewhere else):
Brown did not support Senator Bernie Sanders’s single-payer health plan. Brown said he was supporting his own plan, which would lower Medicare eligibility to 55.
I’d vote for him for President if he runs (not announced and I don’t think he has a good shot) if I lived in a swing state. As is (I’m in CA), Bernie gets my vote and I think a few others but not Brown - otherwise I’ll probably vote Green again.
Bernie Sanders in 2020 for President! On the other side: You lie? Goodbye! Vote ’ em out! Peace
Of course if he runs in the Democratic Primary, he will make the same pledge and have the same follow-through. If you can’t handle that, I guess you have to support someone else. I’m with Joan though - you’d be shooting yourself in the foot.
I’ve done my share of criticizing Sanders, but, even so, I think it would be tragic if he didn’t run, if for no other reason than he is still the least corporate-cozy of all the contenders claiming to have progressive credentials. That in itself makes him a long shot to get the nomination, but at least it brings the issue to the table.
Interpret anyway you want - I think I was pretty clear and did not use the word ‘role’ implying he was assigned to do something which I don’t believe at all. I simply said he was upfront about pledging to support the Democratic nominee given he was running in the primary (and he followed through when the situation was pretty messy). To do anything else (e.g. Michael Bloomberg once said he would run in the Democratic Primary and if Sanders won, he would turn around and run as an independent) is going to obviously penalize you so why do it? (Bloomberg may know financial power, but he is still an ass and he gave me yet another reason never to support him).
The #11th thing we would loose if he doesn’t run. Someone that is authentic. His life, his whole life, is so well documented through governmental service that no one can even hold a candle to it. He was, is and always will be a public servant. If you go to youtube and put in Bernie Sanders in the search bar, bingo for years and years and years. Who can match that? No one! I wrote him in on my ballot last time and I’ll do it again if I have to next time. We need FDR’s 2nd Bill of Rights and Bernie is as close as we can come. I grant you it isn’t all of FDR’s agenda but again, it’s as close as we can come in this political climate. The man is just the right man for the job, his running choice could be interesting. I hope we get to the point where that is a reality to watch in real time. GBG!!!
HI TomJohnson 1 : Cynic : )
HI RZwaeich: I thought Bernie had thought the Dems were smarter than they turned out to be. I honestly believed that if he helped the Hillary that his ideas would be put into the program-----but they didn’t care about his program. If the Hillary etc. had added his ideas, then maybe she could have won… I thought that the DEMS dissed Bernie to destroy him, but he’s still here----and as for the Hillary: She came she spoke, she lied." She is totally done—, and if the Dems run her or Joe, etc. etc. then the Dems are just a carbon copy of the GOPers.