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A Place Where Ideals Go To Die: Defeat Mitch, Please

Of course you see no evidence that leadership skills are taught in the military, you’ve never been in the military, therefor have no knowledge of it’s true structure. You’re statement, “…officers that were terrible ‘leaders’”, proves this. Officers since the mid 20th century have been removed from the troops they “lead”, and most know it’s the Non Commissioned Officers (E-4 through E-9), who share the conditions the basic troops face day to day, and lead these troops to complete what ever mission they were assigned. The MC admits this openly, if not for the NCO’s the organization would fall apart. In the world of military pilots, this doesn’t apply, they don’t have enlisted personnel in their ranks.
“…nothing suggests they would not have these skills were they not in the Military.”
Maybe, maybe not, I have never seen an unbiased study about this subject. There may be truth to the contention that people are born with this skillset, but there is something to be said about military training that brings these skills to the forefront of a persons character and makes them aware they poses these skills. An example: Marines in boot camp are rotated into leadership positions inside their platoons. While they’re in these positions they are forced to put their troops needs above their own, they must make sure everyone in their squad eats before they do, make sure any of their problems are taken care of before their problems are taken care of. Any task that comes up, they must perform that task before any member of their squad does. If they fail to do this, they are rotated out of a leadership position, and it starts all over again with a new recruit. These are but a few examples. I don’t know of anywhere in the civilian world where leaders are forced to put the people they lead’s needs above their own. There are a few jobs where it is expected, but not forced. The fire service is one of those, I would never put a firefighter in any position that I wouldn’t go into myself, but I have seen others do that. Would I have thought that way without military training, I don’t know.
I agree she’s using it to get votes, and was why I put the theory forward in my original post on this subject. You seem to think I meant this was a good thing, I don’t, but I do think it’s one of the reasons she’s using it. I also stand by what I said about the military and leadership. In the example I stated above also shows not everyone choses to use these skills, they are rewarded with very slow advancement in the Marine Corps.
I’m not surprise that this (military experience) is not used in Canada (and probably not in many cultures), and that’s a good thing.
I would agree and disagree with you’re last part. Yes it’s important to know “where exactly is that person trying to lead us”, but equally or more important is, are they going to take care of our society’s needs along the journey, and that is a direct reflection of their leadership skills. To you’re last sentence, I’ll say (as I did above), before the “forever wars” of the 21st century, no one wanted to avoid war as much as the people serving in the military who would have to fight them.
I’ll end this with reference to my other posts on this thread, and say I don’t endorse this woman, nor do I know her, nor can I vote for her.

Hey stardustIBID, yes I agree McGrath is using her military experience to get votes, and apparently in my first post it appeared that I was OK with it, I’m not. I was merely pointing out that she was trying to project an image of a strong woman in a mans world, looking for an edge in the political arena.
Yes there are many, many examples of horrible people who are members of the military, and there are many examples of the same with non-military members. Sadly I’m sure that war multiplies these qualities in humans. As Hugh Thompson proved by putting his life on the line to help save the villagers of My Lai, it doesn’t have to.
“Does Kentucky have a dependence on anything military for it’s economy?”
I don’t have direct knowledge, but that is the strategy of the MIC, spread out military hardware production across the US, so any politician wanting to reduce the MIC budget, will face wrath at home from the voters for reducing their local economy with plant shut-downs.
Gabbard is my first choice (actually Gravel, but he doesn’t want to win), but she doesn’t have the traction to overcome the media ignoring her, I wish that wasn’t the case.

My sister is in the Military. I do not see her as having leadership skills she would not have learned anywheres else. What-ever leadership skills she had could have been taught to her elsewhere.

As to the leaders in your Military again I disagree entirely. You had officers being fragged by thier own troops in Vietnam because of non inherent "leadership’ skills. While guys like “Mad Dog mattis” and General Patrues rose to positions of power, I do not see them as having “leadership skills”.

It just jingoism that the military uses to garner recruits. Join a peace movment and you can develop the same skills IF you have the aptitude for it…

There an old expression “All I know today I learned in kindergarten” . It applies here to military training. If the US Military could teach leadership skills then all persons that joined the Military would be leaders. The vast majority are NOT. All the Military does is pick out the peoples already capable of such. We can pretty well all be taught to read and write , we can not all be taught something as vague as “leadership skills”

Doctor Hakim Young displays leadership skills.
Martin Luther King demonstrated leadership skills.
Greta Thunberg displays leadership skills.

None or military or ex military.

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Well we have certainly beaten this dead horse long enough, so lets just agree to disagree.

AZ had a choice of Deedra Abboud who worked very hard traveling up and down the state holding meeting at outdoor events and in people’s living rooms. Instead they voted for another R proving once again that humans are indeed stupid. That said it is very important to get rid of the Judicial fixer obstructionist. We need turnover even without term limits.

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MAIL a check or postal money order to her actual campaign address!!!

To whom are you referring? When I send donations I always bypass the third party collectors by sending my mail directly to the candidate.

My reference here is a done deal. In AZ the senators do not stand for election for five years. My comment was made to demonstrate the voting public lack of awareness since they frequently vote against what is needed to fix the system.