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Attacks on Greta Thunberg, Say Allies, Show Just How 'Terrified' Reactionary Forces Have Become of Global Climate Movement

Originally published at http://www.commondreams.org/news/2019/09/02/attacks-greta-thunberg-say-allies-show-just-how-terrified-reactionary-forces-have

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“her fearlessness and abilility to speak and act so matter-of-factly”

She doesnt need someone to write her words; no teleprompter; no script - she speaks from her heart.

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Naomi Klein has a book called This Changes Everything, which is about global warming. Early in the book, she talked about attending a right wing conference on the issue and how most of the panels there did not focus on the science. The focus was on the impact global warming was going to have for the capitalist system. It was that which led them to reactively reject the science. She said something not said enough, which is that the far right is far more accurate and realistic about what the environmental crisis means for capitalism than the center left. The center left pretends that we have more time than we do, and that quarter measure non solutions are actual solutions. They say these things because they want brownie points for acknowledging the science very broadly, but want to get away with not offering up policies the science shows we need. We need radical changes, capitalism cannot realistically solve this crisis. The center left, like the right, rejects what needs to be done because it supports the same system. They are opposite sides of the same coin.

Of those running, Bernie’s plan is eons better than the others. Not just because it calls for radical changes, things like expanding public ownership and a greater role for economic planning, but it does it in a very equitable and democratic way. Supporting things like cooperatively owned busnesses working with planning authorities to deliver goods and services. Warren’s plan is okay, better obviously than Trump, could be better than what Obama offered, but pathetically short of what is needed. You could even argue that Beto’s plan is better than Warren’s.

And if anyone wants to debate me on this stuff, if you want to defend capitalism, explain in detail how that system will work with what is coming. A non market crisis that cannot be monetized, reaching the limits to growth in throughout and pollution generation, in a chaotic and decentralized economic system. It is ridiculous to think such a thing can go on much longer.

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Well Joan, people who worship money will soon find out it cannot be eaten.

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Why do Sub-Saharan Africans have the sickle cell anemia gene?

When a person has one sickle cell anemia gene and not two, it confers partial immunity on the person to malaria. When a person has two genes, they have sickle cell anemia. It’s a genetic adaptation to a disease that can decimate an equatorial human population.

Why do people have Asperger Syndrome and autistic spectrum disorders?

Sometimes neurodivergent people are able to concentrate better on logical thinking. They become smarter, they make money and they invent things. Then wealthier and more powerful people tended to have more kids, and so the tendency to be neurodivergent spread through society. At other times people with the same genetic and environmental makeup are a bit less able to function in modern society. At best there’s a balance, and not everybody hits that balance.

Why are there bullies?

Well, becoming a common bully is like becoming a common crook. It’s usually just bad upbringing and in most cases societal punishment is going to be their lot. A few people are sociopaths and that might be genetic.

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And to somewhat support my statement:

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I hate hearing that sentence without hearing what the alternatives might be. So I’ll suggest at least one alternative. If I’m going to design an ecological response to the climate catastrophe, I’m not going to tolerate people telling me, “but the rich people will never go along with that particular proposal.” So, first I’m going to invent a science-fiction economic system that works.

Our world’s system of trade, often backed up by military conquest to get better trade terms, is all that we had for thousands of years in a scarcity-driven society. Human slavery was almost always a part of the free market system.

Academia has developed something called academic integrity. It says that grant money only goes to professors who have previously demonstrated that they can be academically honest with their peers, that they don’t fake their experiments to meet their claims, and that other professors can try to replicate their results. Money can’t buy back your academic integrity after you’ve sold it out. Academic integrity is a non-monetary social value with clout that often results in a monetary gain.

If you’re a mathematics professor, can you get an archaeology grant? Usually, you can’t. Only a bit of general academic integrity can be translated from one field into a different field. Hundreds of different subcategories of technical competence exist.

Street cred is non-academic credibility. For example, does a local musician support her/their/his community?

And so I envision a world where credibility, both in terms of general integrity and in terms of competence, determines your life, whether you can borrow the resources to start a business, a profession or a storefront.

In general, every human being deserves an honest shot at a job, at a profession. However, to succeed they’ll probably need to apprentice themselves and also have mentors and advisory committees who will probably lend them some cred to get them started. These communities might resemble 18th century Friends meetings, where many of each meeting’s young people would be set up in business by their meetings. Friends often dominated banking, insurance, coal mining, iron mongering and the international coffee and tea trade. The Mormons have a weaker version of this economic philosophy.

The base of a credibility system will be locality. Know your farmer, know your doctor and know your computer repair person. After that, neighborhood coalitions of people will have to form coalitions of coalitions, and so something resembling free trade can develop between nearby coalitions.

Internal free markets, sometimes closed to outside vendors and to outside customers, may be permitted.

Art is not fungible. If you steal a $100 million dollar painting from Boston’s Gardner museum, you don’t necessarily have $100 million in cash to spend. The entire organized art world understands that the painting shall forever belong to the Isabella Stewart Gardner art museum and so it can never be sold to anyone even four decades after the heist. In the same way, internal community money can be assigned community rules. For example, if any particular money is found to be gambled or was used to purchase narcotics, by rule that particular money with particular serial numbers, or the electronic equivalent, has no particular worth ever again.

Disputes will arise. The credibility system will need to arbitrate disputes. However, arbitration costs people’s time and somebody has to pay this expense. Society in general will be willing to pay court costs up to a point. After that point the losing litigant pays much of it. And so, this new economic system probably won’t be good to the backbiters of the world. We won’t have one million lawyers.

A street cred system might be just a bit more kindly to the artists of the world than our current system, with a recognition that lots of people inherently want to be artists and few inherently want to work at wastewater treatment plants.

It’s possible to double-cross your community. However, in the worst cases you’ll probably lose your community’s retirement support and you’ll have to ask your new outside friends for a house to live in.

Greta Thunberg: " And then you know you are winning". That is what terrifies Greta’s enemies!

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" She disdains celebrity. She makes no claim to heroism. She rebuffs efforts to idolise her. She isn’t calculating or preoccupied with fame or ego. There is no artifice about her. She speaks plainly, without affectation or embroidery."

"In words and deeds, Thunberg is the embodiment of philosopher Howard Zinn’s admonition: “We don’t have to engage in grand, heroic actions to participate in the process of change. Small acts, when multiplied by millions of people, can quietly become a power no government can suppress, a power that can transform the world.”

Now, compare this to Donnie John. What a huge fucking difference. The mind of a 16 year old as compared to a 73 year old.
Thunberg/Sanders in 2020! :):slight_smile:

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May her enemies fear be followed by their disempowerment, then being bankrupted.

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“She’s achieved more [at age] 16 than they ever will.”

Not just more than they ever will individually but collectively as well. The whole bunch of intellectually deficient reprobates together are not worth one of her.

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it is as young Greta says, if all of us do a little it adds up to a lot. Not taught in schools which very much should be is how the young can teach the old to be climate change conscious in their living habits.

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Instead of “disempowerment”, I first read “disembowelment.” I propose that as a more appropriate outcome.

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Well, I have written about alternatives, and so have many others. Robin Hahnel has, David Schweickart has, the Next Systems project has. But, the point of my post was that capitalism is on borrowed time. The environmental crisis is largely a non market affair, meaning most of the impacts have no market values, there is realistic way to monetize those things and even of we could, the price of everything would explode, which would by itself call for radical changes. We have reached the limits of growth in the real economy and must contain the growth of the financial and monetary systems (which faces no resource constraints) and for many reasons, this cannot realistically be accomplished in a chaotic market system. If someone wants to show how it could, the floor is theirs. The obvious response is for a far more comprehensive form of economic planning, which I hope will be democratic. But, as I said, my point was simply about center left delusions about capitalism’s ability to address the crisis. It is a utopian dream, and if we don’t get serious about focusing on alternatives, the far right will take power and their means of dealing with the crisis will be brutal. Let’s dispense with the notion that the adults in the room are the ones clinging to a system that has no future. The adults in the room are looking past a dying system, and it doesn’t matter whether anyone likes any of this.

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By the way, notions of having free markets and free trade in the future is extremely utopian. The market itself is missing massive amounts of information, so any notion that we will continue to use the market in the future as we do now is unrealistic. And I do not know what you mean by free trade. NAFTA, for example, is called a free trade deal. Most of it had nothing to do with trade at all. Both Ricardo and Smith said that free trade to them (comparative advantage and the invisible hand) was based on an assumption that factories stayed put, that labor and capital flowed freely. What went across borders was goods, labor and capital. It is unrealistic to expect that moving forward, and the idea that all these carbon intensive products consumers in the West like can continue to be created like they are is going to collapse. Components made in dozens of countries (with horrific working conditions and places where there are little environmental regulations), being shipped to places like China to be assembled (where working conditions are horrible and where environmental regulations barely exist) then shipped thousands of miles to be bought by workers, often on credit since wages have stagnated for decades, is not sustainable.

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Greta is smarter, healthier, more ethical, more inspiring than most people, and especially more than her stupid, misogynistic, ageist critics.
We need an army of Gretas, who have been trained to have the skills and feisty attitude of Lisbeth Salander in the original Girl With the Dragon Tattoo movie, to join with others as we say, “no compromise in defense of mother earth.”

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You don’t need girls David, YOU need to take on the boorish, aggressive, cruel, dominating patriarchal fuck heads that are your brothers. Why ask for young women to carry your water? You’ve benefited from masculism all your life, now repudiate it.

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Trump acts like typical 16 year old; Greta acts like an intelligent and mature 73 year old.

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Though also a worthy fate, I would argue against for two reasons:

  1. For that ilk, not being influential is a fate worse than death.
  2. Per the Sicilian maxim, ‘Revenge is a dish best served cold,’ disembowelment requires a level of emotion on the part of the disembowler that violates the maxim.

Shut down DC on Sept. 23:

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