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Bernie Sanders Claps Back After Liz Cheney, Daughter of Bush VP, Attacks 'Fraud of Socialism' on House Floor


#22

Northwest Georgia, where I was born, beautiful with or without the ocean. :slight_smile:


#23

America no longer has honest elections for any government position.
The voters only real crime here is accepting the results.


#24

Sometimes they apply that concept you mentioned with fireman and roads to technology. The phone for example. (Original Landlines at least with the telecom companies… not now with I-Phones though)

I also viewed socialism, in a way, as the reinvestment into capitalism that capitalism is simply too greedy to make on its own. You cant have the one without the other.

But the word drives me f’n crazy. Almost everyone, especially the jackasses on fox news, mean to say communism when they say socialism. They call Sanders a socialist and every one of their viewers is thinking communist.

And the Venezuela trope is so typically mishandled by every single person it ever gets used against.
No one ever points out the simple fact that the food shortages are actually caused by private companies manipulating the prices due to the situation. (Capitalism). Nope. Those dingbats just keep calling it socialism.

While ignoring the CIA coups and economic sanctions.


#25

Yes, by enforcing existing regulations, restoring regulations that the Republican Party and Corporate Democrats have gotten rid of over the last 40 years


#26

During Eisenhower time, the tax on millionaire’s was 90%. Why? So the wealth of the nation didn’t end up in the hands of a few families. Guess what? The repugs got rid of all regulations and controls that kept us a democracy.


#27

Thought Bernie S is a social democrat


#28

That‘s the problem with Republicans. The problem with Democrats is that they let them get away with it. They don‘t articulate the scam so people can understand it. The underdogs have gone over to the side which takes advantage of their labor, their fears, their lack of education, their unwillingness to identify with people who are even worse off. Voting Republican May be a status symbol for many.


#29

STOP BLAMING THE IRAQ WAR ON CHENEY! Put the credit where it belongs!


“The belief in war on Iraq was disseminated by 25 or 30 neo-conservatives, almost all of them Jewish…” from the Israeli news daily Haaretz… If the Jews can admit the invasion of Iraq was a Jewish operation, why can’t the rest of us???
And, by the way, Iraq’s largest oil field, the Majnoon, went to a Jewish founded oil company, Royal Dutch Shell.


#30

Pacifist eco-socialism or barbarism.


#31

Shouldn’t Cheney be in The Hague…?


#32

Go see the movie VICE, the rise of Cheney. It will answer any questions you have on too many lies.


#33

Anyone paying attention is, or should be, as infuriated at the utterly destructive and treasonous trump regime, from its rotten mental-case head to its political shills and equally depraved R’Con henchmen (and women!) cronies and co-conspirators, as Tiaib rightly expressed…she just articulated the outrage millions feel without the “my good friend, so and so” BS - we are way past that rubbish at this point in trumps salted-earth and burning the fields destruction and malignant pathology! All that old-school Republican’s (now apparently extinct) and Democrats of the past worked together for…even if that was not nearly the best and included much rot and coups, and sabotage of nations, it was something more reasonably sane in ways. trump has made the US an ugly (uglier) image of his ego-driven narcissist insanity, ill-education, extreme narrow life experience, overt racism and sexism, and service to robber-baron profits-above-all-else disease!

And who TF is the snot-nose punk NYT “reporter” Nick Fandos to say Rashida’s righteous anger and frustration “Upended Democratic Talking Points”? That is arrogant BS with zero basis in fact!


#34

I enjoyed the socialist medical system that the US military runs just fine during my 20-year career. I also note that people like this POS Cheney also enjoy socialized medicine as members of Congress. Funny how these frauds don’t see how hypocritical they look. Oh, that’s right, they count on their low-information voters not knowing the truth…and for the most part, they’ve been proven right. But changes, they are a’coming, whether people like this fraud of a human being like it or not.


#35

Remember,they would rather be “commies” then democrats. :heart: you Bernie.


#36

Seems the closest we came was Henry Wallace, the VP under FDR.
We need to revive the Progressive Party in the US. The traditionalists will love it. It’s like going back to the 50’s only without the bigotry.


#37

Don’t forget all those publicly-funded stadiums for all the Big Sports teams owned by some of the fattest of the Fat Cats, and — probably the most subsidized and greediest of all beneficiaries of Amerikan Socialism — Big Pharma.

Since when do functioning democracies allow prisoners to visit prisoners?   All three Cheatin’ Cheneys – like all five Dirty Drümphs (Tweetle-Dumb, his three kids and Kushner) – should have been locked up years ago.


#38

Fair enough. In fact, fair right down the line - almost. Why on earth do you exclude health care delivery?


#39

A beautiful meaningful straight-down-the-line truthful rant (apart from the religious fiction at the end)! Just one factual error - apologies for nit-picking, but USSR isn’t (or rather wasn’t) ‘United Soviet Socialist Republic’, it was Union of Soviet Socialist Republics. There were lots of nominally semi-independent Soviet Socialist Republics, most of them now independent (and in many cases islamic, at least nominally) states.


#40

I think they’ll be price takers, not price setters. I’m interested in socializing health care insurance as a way to share risk. I’m not sure what socializing doctors and hospital gains us. Some would argue it gains us elimination of profits, but not-for-profits are never actually non-profit. They can makes themselves look that way by paying higher salaries and those are likely to go to the professionals, not all the employees. Making them government operations is probably a bridge too far at this point.

I don’t necessarily object to socializing delivery, but attempting to do so drastically raises the political stakes and makes achieving socialization of insurance much more difficult. The insurance part is far important, at least for now, I think.

Pharmaceuticals are a different story altogether. Management salary and benefits, along with advertising are parasitic and steal healthcare from everyone. Pharmacy benefit managers add no value to the process, but add enormous costs and ration drugs away from who need them the most and can afford them the least.

As a basic research function, that is, developing new drugs, the NIH would be a far better vehicle. The greed implicit in the patent process is also an unnecessary burden on everyone and only needed to support the profit motive of the pharma industry. It wouldn’t be needed in an NIH-only world.

As a production function, making the drugs once they are formulated is straightforward, like making simple widgets. Delivery is also pretty much of a no-brainer. I wouldn’t object to local pharmacies for delivery, though. In fact, having someone local to talk to when you get your medicine is a great idea – as opposed to the industrialized mail order operations that dominate the market today.

But I’m open to other arguments and approaches.


#41

Sounds as though what you would really like to see is the system that was VERY successfully introduced (against a background of howls of protest and attempted sabotage by large parts of the private sector) in the UK following the Second World War. The National Health Service, including Doctors and Hospitals, worked beautifully for years - even the Tory governments of the 50s, the so-called one nation Tories, recognised the sense (and value!) of it. Come Thatcher all that went out of the window. Private profit - good. Public good - bad. Since then the Tories, including those in Bliar’s New ‘Labour’ government, have joyfully wrecked the model and basically sold the NHS off cheap to their mates. Sod the general public - they’re of no interest except as cannon fodder for industry or the military. Sound familiar?