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Bernie Sanders: Ruinous 2020 Debate Showcased Why Trump Is 'Most Dangerous President' in US History

Originally published at http://www.commondreams.org/news/2020/09/30/bernie-sanders-ruinous-2020-debate-showcased-why-trump-most-dangerous-president-us

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Saw this someplace and it pretty much sums up how I look at this election and any undecideds.

It’s like if you are hungry and have a choice between a hamburger and a bowl of broken glass.

Except for the totally captured Trump 44%, I don’t see how Trump can get any independent votes, he’s that bad, and the debate pretty much proved it. Biden was not in my top 5 choices, but I am still going to choose the hamburger over the bowl of broken glass, at least the hamburger won’t kill me.

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Biden is a hamburger like in the old Warner Bros cartoon where two guys are stranded on a deserted island and they start hallucinating, seeing each other as food - one guy looks like a hamburger to the other. We might see Biden as that hamburger because we’re starving. I see it as Biden is like doses of arsenic that will kill you slowly over time. Trump is like drinking a bottle of Drano. Of course hardcore Trumpists would probably believe their guy if he told them that Drano is the cure for coronavirus.

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As a Independent this is just SO freaking frustrating! America needs more than TWO PARTIES! Everyone keeps saying “BUT, we need to get him out of office first! Then we can have nice things like Single Payer, Guaranteed college! But, But, we have to get him out first, and only a Centrist can do that, then we can have nice things”! As a retired Union Electrical Lineman I am really sick and tired of the two party system. This Country absolutely HAS to do something about Healthcare, Climate Change, Minimum wage, Schools, and progressing OFF of dirty energy.

This debate tonight was a crap show. Embarrassing! And, to think half of Americans actually support this S__t Show is unnerving. Watching the Debate, I thought "Wow, here we are, watching two OLD rich white men having a brawl on public TV! We NEED young, progressive, people with vision and less entrenched partisan parties who keep us locked in the status quo. Sad.

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Bernie is absolutely correct.
The factual record shows that Trump is our American Hitler, a uniquely corrupt, sick, dangerous person with no redeeming qualities who seeks to become a Fuhrer and King.
He and his cult are a cancer within, and must be excised.
Recall Germany 1934.
If we don’t purge Trump, the GOP, and the Trump cult from America, we face the same horrible fate.

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Thats the nice part about Donald Trump. You never have to wonder what’s on his mind, as there is absolutely nothing on his mind.
What sanders failed to address was just how last nights debate was a microcosm of the American body politic in 2020.
The Great American shit show.

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I notice you didn’t say a word about the other cult. Now, to be objective (rather than devout partisan):

And who has enabled him along the way and served as enablers and accomplices by their votes or with their silence since he took office? The other right-wing cult which pretends to be an opposition party. Two examples that come to mind: They – including Representative Pelosi and Representative Ocasio-Cortez – voted to give him his record war budget around the same time as their impeachment show. If they truly wanted him gone (impeached), they wouldn’t have given him anything. Then they voted to give him more spying powers. It’s best to be objective, rather than partisan (“rah, rah, my team, go team to”).

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As it turns out, we have more than two parties (with the Green Party currently being the most prominent on the left) - but we do not have a level playing field for them to compete - and even with a level playing field, there is not enough support at this point in time for them to be competitive at the Presidential level. Thus, I believe the best strategy is then

  1. To work for initiatives for Ranked Choice Voting systems, equal access to public forums for all ballot qualified candidates, and transparency and limits on large donor and corporate election financing for as many jurisdictions as possible (we have that now in Maine, and RCV is on the ballot this year in Alaska and Massachusetts)

  2. To work for progressive Democrats in primaries against corporate Democrats and for Green Party candidates in the general election against establishment party candidates in state and local offices.

Click here for four great candidates that I strongly recommend this year
* Lisa Savage running for Senate in Maine (~LisaForMaine.org)
* Fred Horch running for State Legislature in Maine (~Horch2020.org)
* Jake Tonkel running for San Jose City Council in California (~Jake4D6.com)
* Charlene DiCalogero running for State Legislature in Massachusetts (~charleneisgreen.nationbuilder.com)
  1. To work for the Movement for a People’s Party (~peoplesparty.org) that seeks to build a coalition between progressives and leftists in both the electoral and movement politics domains.

  2. To work for public funding of candidates, to not work for candidates who take corporate funding,
    and to seek out candidates who do exceptional work in running campaigns that avoid the corruption that comes with money in politics (see Fred Horch’s campaign in Maine as an exemplar)

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Unfortunately Trump managed to get Biden to be honest and throw and left leaning and progressive voters under the bus.
Biden said he is against the Green New Deal, against Medicare for All. Biden claimed to be the Dem party. His plan for climate change is a joke. Most progressives are not surprised by this.

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That should be lower case “i” assuming you mean you’re non-partisan (no party affiliation). Upper case “I” is for the right-wing American Independent Party. Hope this helps.

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No spell check, before Covfefe! :smile:

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BERNIE, always my President in my heart!

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I have never been crazy about Biden, and detest what has become of the "Democratic’ Party. But I was fairly impressed with Biden’s feistiness and the way he stood up to Trump’s constant interrupting and bullying. Donnie didn’t look too good. Chris Wallace deserves a medal. To the world, it looked like a parody of America - two old white dudes shouting and interrupting each other (though Biden had little choice). Chaotic. Unpredictable, A mess.

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It is interesting! I thought Biden was against Medicare for all/Single payer, and only wanted to prop up the “inadequate” ACA. But, now Biden is running ads for Single Payer in Florida. I saw at least 4 or 5 of them just a few days ago. Maybe, Kamala is making him lean more Progressive

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I came away thinking the same thing! I just wish Biden would not have allowed Trump to goad him so much. Obama was always able to let the crap roll off and then stay focused without taking the bait. Trump wanted a brawl and sadly, Biden didn’t walk away from it and address what we want to hear. A plan to get this Country back on track and solve problems.

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Neither of the warring candidates has the record, the skills or the integrity to serve as US president.
Both are corrupt - one flaunts it and one tries to hide it with words and finger-pointing. Both have
contempt for American values - one pledges his loyalty to those who support him (only criterion)
and the other openly shouts ‘I don’t work for you’ when challenged at a campaign event’.
The Great American [what you said] is going to end if - and only if - the majority of Americans refuse
to play the games of ‘lesser evil’ and ‘whose turn is it to be President?’. Whatever the old saw is about
doing the same thing over and over (and over and over and over) and expecting different results…

No doubt its a bit late in the day for dumping all the tea in Boston in the river. It is not too late to reject
both these “losers” and put in Hawkins and Walker, both of whom support the programs Bernie deserted,
have actually worked during their lives here-to-fore, and speak the truth - and let’s don’t ever minimize the
last one. Do we suppose the sky would fall any quicker were there someone HONEST in the highest office than with either the two juvenile old men who spend 90 minutes or so calling each other names?

In some interviews after the debate, Trump supporters reminded me very much of the sketch SNL did
several times during the time that O was elected - called ‘what would it take?’ or something of that sort.
where original ecstatic Obama supporters were presented with various hypotheticals about horrendous
things he might do or had done, then asked ‘would you still vote for him’ and the answer was always yes.
Same with T supporters post-debate yesterday who felt T’s approach was deplorable but indicated it would not affect their voting for him in the coming election. JMO but I believe its entirely possible that many of those who are voting T over B would have voted for Sanders and perhaps even the Greens
because they were actually standing firm for things that were increasingly core to the nation
and its ‘ordinary people’ surviving. The reasons for voting - whether its Trump or anyone else -
are often multi-level in nature and Clinton’s ‘basket of deplorables’ is nothing but a wholesale value judgment over a people as if they all kept their sheet and hood pressed for the weekend.

So Bernie’s ‘most dangerous President in history’ rings hollow. If you really believed that you don’t
just don’t walk away when you have been forced out of the running twice in a row by a small
cadre of power brokers within the DNC, then, endorse the absolute worst of your former candidate colleagues and start blaming everything on Trump.

Trump is extraordinarily unethical, a cheater in many respects,a liar and a big believer in nepotism. Biden is also extraordinarily unethical, a cheater in many respects, a liar and a big believer in ‘share the
wealth with the family’ if not classic appointment nepotism. They have both evidenced classic racist language and attitudes during the period during which that kind of thing sadly raised few eyebrows. Both have shown throughout their careers, no compunction about enacting measures which fall most heavily on the low income and of color citizens. Both are old men who never moved with the times/society and are as outdated as the overpriced vintage clothing one can acquire on ebay. Both are cruel - Trump openly as what was
apparently instilled in childhood - Biden hiding behind a big sly smile but visible in the “I don’t work for
you” and more recent “clap, you stupid b…” when a group of military folks attending one of his
rare campaign events failed to acknowledge his attempt at humor.

Trump and Biden are 100% CREATURES OF THE PAST who have never moved on since the day they discovered the easiest way to accumulate money was to toss the mental debating about right/wrong,
just/unjust, fair/unfair and lost their integrity if any in fact theretofore existed. Americans of similar age know exactly what was going on with the decades ago racists statements of both Trump and Biden. AMERICA’S CHILDREN ARE CREATURES OF THE FUTURE. Both Trump and Biden will likely be
no longer alive in a decade or less.

If there was ever a compelling reason for those of us in what is called the ‘boomer’ generation to do some
ultimate heroic deed, it would surely be to leave a new system, and get rid of all contentions that those
who ‘run’ elections are exercising a private function. They are not. And neither are those who once
elected do little but take ‘contributions’ from the worst quarters of American business specifically so that
they will elevate private interests above public ones.

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With Trump we die immediately as was proven for over 200,000 Americans. Those remaining alive get to loose their human rights, healthcare, Medicare or other health insurance, livelihoods, businesses…the negative possibilities are endless, deadly and swift. With Biden we get a lot slower breakdown which gives us time and a chance to develop a strategy for survival. Get Trump out, Biden in and then use the time to immediately develop a powerful Progressive Party since the republican and democratic parties are almost completely merged into one.

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I hear what you’re saying Lynn, but FWIW I believe its pure fantasy that things would play out with
Biden. As Harris has openly termed it, any “Biden win” will be (her words) “a Harris administration with Joseph Biden as President”. Sometimes there’s no longer time left to pursue alternatives. This year’s
candidates are both horrible. If either wins, there is not, at least in my limited remaining lifetime ever going to be a more appropriate time for a massive change. A tide in the affairs of men which, TAKEN AT THE FLOOD, leads on to victory, etc.

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I agree with you, and many others do to, it’s the reason Trump was elected. Many independents thought they were doing the right thing in 2016 by voting for Trump because he wasn’t an establishment candidate, unfortunately they didn’t research Trumps background, and that vote blew-up in their face. There is a new party forming that hopefully will bring most voters outside of the current two parties, together. It’s called The Peoples Party, I encourage you to check it out, search by adding dot org to the end.

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Wasn’t going to watch this debate, but caved in. Wish I hadn’t.

Both of these candidates are grotesque and pathetic.

What this spectacle did illustrate was that each candidate in his own way is just as corrupt and craven as the other. One would be hard pressed to scour the world to find a candidate that doesn’t own the high ground when compared to trump on most of the issues important to the populous: healthcare, policing, inequality, tax code, environment, corruption. But the democrats have done it again.

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