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Can the Democrats Save Themselves?

Can the Democrats Save Themselves?

Christopher Cook

New "autopsy" report urges progressive "re-boot"


Lipstick on a pig. Only a new, progressive, socialist, antiwar, green party can save us.


George Washington warned us about the tyranny of political parties.

As long as the current duopoly is in place, well-intentioned suggestions to join the Greens are a blueprint for failure.

The duopoly writes the rules, and the rules are designed to freeze out third parties.

The Republicans are now controlled by a right-wing minority, and the Democrats sold their souls to Wall Street years ago.

I favor disengaging from both parties.

I encourage reasonable people to eschew party labels. Resign from party affiliation and become independents. Only when membership dwindles to the point where it reflects how out of touch both parties are will we stand any chance of reforming a totally corrupt electoral system.


They aren’t even a real opposition party. Many have said that it’s because both parties feed at the same money trough. The big donor fund both parties so no matter which one wins, they still come out on top.

Comedian Bill Maher says the Demos are wimpy and seem afraid to fight, to go for the juggler, to do to the Repubs what they always do to the Demos.

Democrats have long reminded me of those “opponents” boxing promoters put boxers they are building up in agsinst to put up a credible fight and lose but look competitive doing so.

The voting public has always been convinced, with mainstream media help, that The Two Party System is Constitutionally mandated making it nearly impossible for third party people to effectively compete.

Unless candidates show up for near future elections who have exciting fighting charisma who really want to change things, things can’t change


And, as I’m sure you know, there is absolutely no mention of political parties in the Constitution.


The question is more like can we save ourselves from the Vichy democrats? I’m sure they’d be happy to continue on their merry way “fundraising” as the party rots out from under their feet. They don’t need to be saved, they need to be taken out of our misery.
IMO part of the problem is that a large part of the population has no living memory of the party before it was hijacked and corrupted by the New Democrats. They’ve never known the party that stood for the working class and protected them from the Capitalists. They’ve only had a party of lesser expectations made up of human Pez machines that spit out the same sweet nothings every time they open their pie holes.
In my lifetime they’ve gone from protecting and growing the New Deal, to falsely resting on it’s laurels to actively running against B.Sanders’ call for a return of it’s principles.
That was the last straw for me. I’ve never voted for a republican in my 58 years but, unless it’s a real democrat in a primary, I’ll never vote for another until the New Democrat/Clintonite rot is amputated.


Yes, but in order for that disengagement to register, please consider voting exclusively Green, independent or write-in unless and until the duopoly rewrites those rules “designed to freeze out third parties.”

Boycotting elections on principle is effectivley indistinguishable from apathy and alienation—which the 1% actively cultivate.


So if you are in Virginia, and the race comes down to a Democratic Governor negotiating the next Congressional and legislative reapportionment with a right wing legislature, or a Republican one, you’d vote in a way to maximize the potential for the Republican to do that? Because that’s what you are saying. The next crack won’t come for another decade then, and that’s a long time for hard right conservatives to hold the legislature. The best you could do after, is elect a new governor after four years and hold off their worst impulses, maybe. Of course, you’d probably yell at said Governor for being a sellout because they have no choice but to work with the lunatics folks like you, when you had the opportunity, chose to aid staying in power.

You do realize that’s how things work in real life, right? After the census, the legislature draws up new districts.

How’s your candidate going to fair in one of those hard Republican districts?

Disengaging from party affiliation should not imply boycotting elections. I’m sorry you made that leap.

On the contrary, it is important for independent voters to vote in large numbers.

I would not, however, agree to vote exclusively for Green, independent, or write-in candidates. I vote for individuals based on where they stand on issues.

In many cases for whom to vote is a much more complex issue. As KC2669 points out, there may be occasions where one of the major party candidates comes closest to representing my interests.


So tell us, Mr. Realist, how would yet more strategic lesser-evilism change things for the better? What’s your plan for getting either of the privileged parties back to first principles?


Sure. You vote in a way that maximizes less potential for hard right legislators dominating the legislature if you are in Virginia this election. That’s the only way, or you’ll be stuck. Your Green or independent candidates are going to fair better in competitively drawn districts in the future, after all, than districts where the only thing a legislator has to worry about is a primary from the hard right. The way you do that is by making sure the governor isn’t a Republican after the next census. The time to do that, by the way, is now.

Understood, but remember what Candidate Trump said about “draining the swamp?” And, having gotten enough people to vote for him, promptly nominated half the denizens of the swamp to his cabinet?

As I recall, President Obama’s acts also failed—consistently!—to match Candidate Obama’s sweet talk. It’s hard to tell where a candidate stands based solely on public statements, and harder still to make even one of them do what they said they would do once in power.


That happens in life, but elections are about choices and a variety of issues. If you are in Virginia, the choice is simple: do you want Republicans in full control of legislative reapportionment, or not. You don’t like Democrats or Republicans and that’s fine. But what is going to give your preference a chance in the future? Locking in hard right Republican majorities after the next census, or creating more competitive districts? There’s one way to make the latter possible this election if you are in Virginia, one way.

I have no illusions about the likelihood of converting D hardliners to Greens. I’m far more interested in the majority of US citizens who don’t vote. Why do you think they feel it’s a waste of time and energy?


I’ve missed an election before, it happens. But if you are thinking that people don’t vote because they have no choices, well, leaving Republicans in charge of reapportionment sure is an excellent way of minimizing choices. And, the biggest reason people don’t vote is inconvenience. Don’t you think that’s why Republicans are making it harder to vote in states they do control? All I’m saying is if you are in Virginia, and you want to maximize choices in future elections, you are working against yourself by voting third party this time in the goveror’s race.

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As it happens, I don’t live in Virginia. My state is facing a choice between the lieutenant governor of the most widely-disliked governor in its history, and another Government-Sachs stiff. (There are also five other candidates on the ballot, but only two are allowed to “debate” through bipartisan collusion and media complicity).

re “And, the biggest reason people don’t vote is inconvenience.”

I say it’s because they’ve grown weary of being lied to, sold out and taken for granted for so long BY BOTH ALLOWED PARTIES. Do you have any sources for your assertion.?


Vox has a good article on it:

This is from the Post:

MSNBC did a wrap up too:

Note: I file “too busy” under the same shade as inconvenient. Also, I’m not saying inconvenience is the only reason people don’t vote. So count me as being a bit hyperbolic on that score. It may not be the biggest, but it’s a biggy.

On my points above, I am not saying never vote third or independent. Just noting that there are times, such as in Virginia now, where doing so would be working against yourself.

“The question looming over all this is—how and why would the Democratic Party contradict the corporate and wealth interests that undergird its financial support? Why would the party suddenly abandon its big money funders and the “New Democrat” neoliberal agenda the party has been following for decades?”

The autopsy report failed to state the most important recommendation, taking the money out of politics and banning lobbyists.

Direct Democracy


Good analysis of the bizarre state of politics by Max Blumenthal. Starts at about minute 29:15.

I know, it’s on Sputnik so that makes me a Kremlin stooge, etc. Listen anyway. It’s quite a hoot.


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You and your beloved corporate sell-out Democrats are LOSERS.

You have NO ANSWER for the questions you receive about the ugly sell-outs who CONTROL the Democratic Party and help deliver Donald Trump.

You IGNORE the article, and you switch the topic.

The article is CORRECT, and you are an endless apologist for the corporate SELL-OUTS who own and operate the Democratic Party.