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Evolution or Revolution? Town Hall Clarifies the Choice for Democrats


Evolution or Revolution? Town Hall Clarifies the Choice for Democrats

Isaiah Poole

For those who have been closely watching the Democratic presidential contest between Hillary Clinton, Martin O’Malley and Bernie Sanders, Tuesday night’s Iowa town hall discussion on CNN did not reveal anything dramatically new about the candidates. But it perhaps brought into sharper relief the fundamental question that Democratic primary voters face: Do the fundamental problems of our economy and democracy require a technician to repair things or a remodeler who can re-imagine and rebuild?


I certainly share your enthusiasm Mr. Poole. The question now is if enough people are paying attention.


Yes, Bernie I agree America needs a political revolution where millions stand behind you, but unless you get the Democratic nomination for POTUS there will be no political revolution and from my perspective, that is the elephant in the room.


The fixing ACA is nearly impossible. In Switzerland they use private insurance as providers of for their healthcare system, however they are required to be "not for profit". This means limited profit (usually 12% maximum) this is kind of like credit unions or public utilities. The problem we would have is that it would not be sufficient to please their share holders. It would also open the door to more fraud, causing creative ways to manipulate their capital expenditures so that it looks as though they are under the profit limit. I have seen this at work, it is part of our culture.


i absolutely agree with you: Attempting to "compromise" and "work with" and "reform" the obviously rapacious and conscienceless "health insurance" sector is at best a fool's game. In reality, a campaign that pledges to do that, is more of a "pre-sell out" to those interests.

And there is NO NEED for any such "health insurance" sector, which is purely parasitic. Sanders' plan is the realist plan.


Which brings to mind a famous quote from JFK: "Those who make..."


The ruse of finding common ground is the perfect pretext for maintaining a system that is absolutely deferential to the very rich.

Bill Clinton during his reign was considered a genius in the art of bipartisan negotiation. In reality, he merely advanced a pro-business agenda that's typically defined as the primary Republican agenda.

So to see Hillary dust off this same strategy is proof positive that she intends to maintain pro-corporate policies by pretending they are the mark of deft bipartisan negotiation.

As MANY here recognized, Obama stalled to do anything genuinely progressive when he had the backing of Congress. Once Repugs got the majority, he could fall back on the seemingly true defense that he could not advance his more progressive agenda due to congressional gridlock.

It's the perfect ploy... for retaining business as usual no matter that more and more wealth is being retained in fewer and fewer hands; that unemployment numbers are totally farcical; that yet more NAFTA-style treaties are in the pipeline; and so many have lost equity in their homes and genuine job security (with benefits).

So here's Mrs. Clinton's version of the art of triangulation propped up as the mark of a successful, experienced politician:

"Clinton was asked how she would advance her vision of reform in the face of a hostile Republican Congress. “Everything I want to do, I want to start from the belief that we can find common ground, and that is exactly what I intend to do,” she said. “So, I’m going to be just giving them all bear hugs whether they like it or not. … Maybe we can get something done together, if not, maybe I can find that slice of common ground to find somebody who will work with me on achieving a goal that we want.”

The goal--in case anyone missed it--is more power to corporate overlords, more militarism and wars, and more resource-decimation and consequent climate chaos.

Imagine arguing for THAT?


I think the more honest question is how many Black voters will be hampered from voting? And how many states will use touch-screens whose "vote counts" can be tampered with by computer.

So many here fall back into formation to push the voters don't care line. IF such a position was offered with all of the other impediments to honest outcomes given equal mention, I'd respect it.

Too often this alone is used as a bludgeon with which to attack the masses rather than address the systemic deceptions and structural anomalies that grant the 1% this much dominion under the guise of Democracy.

Those who could vote and in the past stayed home recognized the system doesn't really alter regardless of which party takes command.

Many of us see in Mr. Sanders a shift in that depressing paradigm.


To answer the question posed by the header, American politics, government, health care, regulatory policies, judicial system, taxation, and energy policy all need to be reformed.

Taken together, I'd say that's pretty revolutionary.

A good place to start would be to follow Thom Hartmann's call for abolishing the false idea that legal entities (corporations) are entitled to the same rights and protections ceded by the U.S. Constitution to "natural born citizens."


The FCC needs to be compelled to re-institute the "Fairness Doctrine." (I've been trying to follow what's happening with the Flint water crisis. MSNBC has stepped up its whoring for the Clinton Campaign.) As long as we continue allowing political heads to broadcast their hate speech, "spin," and lying propaganda, our society will remain divided with little hope that any meaningful reform will ever be put into effect.

Of critical importance is the need to re-regulate the banking and investment industries. We need to prosecute and jail the executives and employees of institutions that continue to rape America's residents and our economy. Corrupt investment banks need to be liquidated.

Let the heads roll !!!


the revolution has already begun, we will vote Corporate politicians out starting with Congress then the Senate we are mobilizing


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Hillary wants to be " the melder " of the polarized left and polarized right. She'll seek " common ground " with her opponents on a wide range of pressing issues. And, we'll move together, sort of like line dancing I suppose, to a better America.:wink: In the 90s this was marketed as " the radical middle " solution to our collective woes. Some pols/think tanks called it 3rd Way. Fast forward 20 years, please. Just listen to Sen. Sanders, a man with 33 years of local and federal governing experience, and his advisers list all the financial disasters we've encountered since then. What has $17 Trillion in new debt bought us? Who can live on less than $8 bucks an hour? Who can afford $300 a month health insurance, with $5000 deductibles, while making the same salary/wages as they did in 1995? How safe are we when we spend $1 Trillion or more, a year, on the DoD and the Police & Security State? When children are being poisoned and murdered in our own country because there's just not enough money to give them some clean water? And, on and on it goes... This is not some kind of new happy dance but the same old ride on the same old merry-go-round, from these same old Democrats. If Bernie saying, " Enough is Enough " is somehow revolutionary, we're in a hell of lot more trouble than we think. He's not the only one being " framed " by the PTB, here, ya' know.


a clear choice is before us and unless we are completely unseeing and unknowing, it is BERNIE. GO BERNIE GO and remember he is not in this revolution by himself. Without us, there will be no revolution. He has said it. I believe it. Are you ready????????


I was surprised how good O'Malley was in that type of setting. It will be interesting to see if it gives him the type of boost he has so far failed to get. .


There may be a total of 6 republican and Democratic members of the House and Senate who have relatively clean hands. And on the republican side, I'm not even sure that there are any. The republican Party needs to be indicted en masse, IMO.

For the Democrats that failed to stand in opposition to the republican agenda, they deserve to be sent packing at the very least.


Nice enough guy. He's in the wrong situation, here. VP run, possibly? A more polished Joe Biden, perhaps? If he goes from 2% to 4% what does that mean? I know some Clintonistas wish he'd drop out but I think his supporters would split 50/50. Anyway, the Iowa Democratic caucus rules are tilted to favor Hillary and the DNC made sure of that, btw. Her desire to be President is amazing. It's like she'd say almost anything to win, right?:sunglasses: Also, the Iowa caucuses require a 15% threshold for O'Malley's supporters to gain much traction or delegates. Ouch!


My favorite image of the day:

Hillary Clinton pacing back and forth across a stage in Iowa, microphone in her hand. I can't remember what she was ranting about.

As a backdrop, she was using the obligatory group of people carefully selected as to their age, race, gender, etc. They may have been sitting on gym bleachers; couldn't tell due to the camera's framing. You're familiar with the crowd; it's the same phony group of spectators assembled by a campaign staff designed to project the image the politicians feeding the crowd a bunch of malarkey has the support of the "common" folk we've seen for the last 15 years or so.

Anyway, what held my attention away from Hillary's nonsense was a 14-year-old girl with shoulder length brunette hair sitting there and holding the folder that had been passed out to the spectators by Hillary's staffers that read "CLINTON" on the cover with one hand. In her other hand, she was holding her phone and texting to her friends, completely ignoring what Clinton was saying.

It gave me the impression she had started out hiding her phone in her lap and using the CLINTON folder as a shield as if she were in a classroom and didn't want the teacher to find out she was texting instead of paying attention to the lesson. Eventually she gave up trying to hide what she was doing; heck, no one got after her for not paying attention, so why not.

Maybe she didn't get paid the $50 she'd been promised because she failed to be a good spectator zombie.


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But remember HRC admitted she " made a mistake" voting to attack Iraq in 2003. Millions of us protested in the US and around the world the illegal invasion of Iraq and knew it was based on bogus reasons that Saddam had WMD's.

Hilliary rotten Clinton is lying! She did not make a mistake! She is not that stupid! HRC prostituted herself to the Bush/Cheney Administration.