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How Far Will North Dakota Go to Get This Pipeline?


#1

How Far Will North Dakota Go to Get This Pipeline?

Mark Trahant

CANNON BALL, N.D. | A peaceful protest against the Dakota Access Pipeline ended in the arrests of 83 people in North Dakota on Saturday morning amid a chaotic scene in which police in riot gear used pepper spray to break up and subdue a group of 200 to 300 protesters.

It is the highest number of people arrested in a single day in North Dakota during the last several months of protest actions against the oil pipeline, bringing the total number of arrests up to 222.


#3

People often ask, "What is Fascism?" Many of us have answered in detail. Here it is in short form for all to see, right in this article and the photos.
* The 0.001% set its agenda for control, power and profit.
* Government is bought and paid for to see that the corporations are not interfered with. If they succeed, they are rewarded even more handsomely.
* The Oligarchy is so confidant that they will have a Nazi Queen in January that will see that their wildest dreams come true, that since they want it all now, they are just jumping the gun to get it. They figure that, after January, they will be bothered no more by those pesky little people.
* I hope they are not right.
* As for me, I'll never be conned into the "lesser of two evils," ever again. The lesser of two evils is still evil!
*My vote is for decency and caring, empathy, and peace!
* Jill Stein, Green, 2016 and beyond!
;-})


#4

What happens when the water protectors bring along their own little doggies for protection, and each person straps on a holster with two cans of pepper spray and a taser to defend democracy from the thugs?


#5

They lose their integrity. Their strength is their nonviolent resistance.


#6

There's a lot of good information and dramatic presentation in there, but this unidentified attribution and its conclusions,

runs off the rails into inflammatory promotion of ignorance.

Did the good professor miss this 9/9 statement by the Depts of Justice, Army, and Interior, including the pretty clear assurance that

The Army will not authorize constructing the Dakota Access pipeline on Corps land bordering or under Lake Oahe until it can determine whether it will need to reconsider any of its previous decisions regarding the Lake Oahe site under the National Environmental Policy Act (NEPA) or other federal laws. Therefore, construction of the pipeline on Army Corps land bordering or under Lake Oahe will not go forward at this time. [emphasis added]

With a response due from the White House to a petition that collected more than twice the required number of signatures, it would take a lot more than the Morton County sheriff and the State of North Dakota to blithely pry easements out of the Army Corps. DAPL may not be at the top of the news, but there are plenty of USAmericans with their eyes on what will happen.


#9

Get over it. This isn't about you and me and hypothetical situations. This is about a group's choice to "protect" their water without violence. I respect that.


#10

Obama is silent. HRC is silent. The DP and RP is silent. MSM is silent. Celebrities are silent. Eco activists have been silenced. The pipeline is going to be built and what the people want is meaningless. What's coming? Someone is going to die, that's what, as this militarization there increases and someone suited up, armed, takes the shot on one of the protesters. People dying is what has occurred for decades where these fossil fuel companies (and all other resource hungry cannibals) have raped and pillaged the planet-- Nigeria (oil), Honduras (land), South Africa (diamond and gold mines), South America (gold mines), Mexico (land and minerals/gems). That is the short list, add to it. The fight has come home and it is going to be bloody.


#11

If someone is killed, the voices you counted off as silent will have to speak. And in fact the Obama administration (Depts of Justice, Interior, and Army) have not been silent, and are committed to more than 200,000 petitioners to speak again. But silence can be powerful. Let's listen to the Protectors and follow their lead.


#12

Does anyone bother with facts? I live here. This is far from peaceful . So peaceful protesters need masks?


#13

Why don't you share some documented facts and photos to support your comment?


#14

You need to say more for us to understand you. Have you observed violence on both sides?


#15

Unfortunately, the government will take one quick look, say "Just what we've been waiting for!" and in will come troops, heavy weapons, lots of violence, some dead or wounded protesters, and a story about how the government had nipped a riot (or a revolution) in the bud with minor casualties. The jails will begin to fill even more, and the charges will all have long term imprisonment attached.
* Sadly, the only thing that is keeping that from happening is the fact that the protesters are unarmed, non-violent, and make easy targets. Hard to call that rioting, though they are trying.
* The Nazi Queen will see that the governments, police, etc., have more power and We the People have even less.
* Remember, the "Lesser of two evils" is still evil!
* I will vote for peace and sanity, caring and empathy, people power!
* Jill Stein, Green, 2016 and beyond!
;-})


#16

Will do when I get home on a real keyboard. But know that this isn't on tribal land. The pipe line route is in conjunction with a gas line route that goes under the river so this route had been vetted and no artifacts were found. The natives started a peaceful protest but we're over run with professional protesters.


#17

I'll look forward to your further details, but I have been making this one point in many threads here, and yesterday managed to track down maps of the tribal lands and the pipeline route that can be roughly overlaid or at least compared side by side. It does appear that the route was very carefully chosen to skirt the tribal land, but it's not clear what use of the other acreage the Sioux may have had by custom before it was sold (whether outright or by easement) to Energy Transfer.


#18

No.
You miss the Protector point of view completely.
These actions by Standing Rock, using prayer, non-violent civil disobedience is the real power and it's driving ETP nutz, with the whole world on alert and watching. Anyone with half a brain can see how bought and sold the state of ND is, how corrupt Morton county in particular is and then there is this is this pesky little matter of treaty violations. Eminent domain may well be turned on its head, against ETP!
I was just there, btw.


#19

Who exactly are you referring to: the Protectors or the militarized police and sheriffs?
I was there too.
Masks? Its frickin' cold out!
We are, however encouraged to not wear them...But it is frigging cold.


#20

No, those voices have already spoken little about killing many. The cartel that is the larger player here is a serial killer of Asia and Africa, and the grotesque multi-decade charges levied selectively against journalists are designed to cover fresh abuse and an escalation of abuse.

I think it is precise to say that by defending themselves with arms, the Defenders do not lose their legitimacy at all, but their lives. The government is far more free to kill them and defend its own fictional legitimacy if they resist with arms, so a non-violent tactic is surely advisable.

North Dakota is in all events mostly a proxy player here, and Obama and Clinton and many public office-holders are in deep collusion. The Obama administration has indeed responded, however, making a public show to reduce the violence.

Getting this again absolutely depends on public pressure, not silence. The government must understand that it cannot repair its own legitimacy after it proceeds with violence in this case.


#21

Morgan, I suspect this is correct and will increasingly apply to various protests. However, I do not suspect that violence is advisable from the point of view of protest or protesters.

The power of government comes from a fiction of legitimacy. Government is legitimate, roughly, either because it is regarded as more or less right or lawful, or because it wields force. Of these two, the fiction that it is right or lawful is far, far less expensive to maintain.

We do not have the solidarity for military resistance. We may have some solidarity for non-violent intervention, non-cooperation, civil disobedience, and direct action.

The work of Gene Sharp, much of it collected in the Online Library of the Albert Einstein Institute, takes a hard look at the relative pragmatics (http://www.aeinstein.org/). To generalize, nonviolent movements succeed more often and leave less mess, even against very harsh opposition.


#22

Yeah, with bells and whistles, to to speak.

I suspect that people would see this more readily were Americans more familiar with details of the banana republic dictators and little Hitlers of the last 80 years or so of CIA interventions. The people who have rigged the US nomination and election for 2016 are the same individuals or trained by the same individuals who have done this abroad across the empire for decades.

One of the consequences of the quick erosion of electoral options brought on by the refusal of loyal Democrats to respond against the party's slide into fascism is that institutions will tend less to Americans' opinions of right and more to coercion as a means of control (sorry to pick on the Dems again, but there are probably very few of us on this forum who have any fantasy that the Republicans will pull us away from this).

I think that hard rain we were told of may finally be about to fall.


#23

Explain what masks have to do with anything?