Impeach - Indict - Incarcerate.
Maga = my attorney got arrested!!! This article’s assessment of the situation sounds bout right to me, Pence wouldn’t have the deranged sometimes extremist base that Trump has. This would be much better for our society and the planet as a whole. Trump has the potential to be a dictator, Pence not so much.
djt’s presence in the WH isn’t the greatest threat to democracy and the Constitution. He hasn’t actually been able to do much damage within his executive (he thinks monarchical) powers. And Pence was indeed put into the backup spot as a payoff to the Christianistic Right and the GOP power structure. But look at what he’s been up to from that position:
P’s determination and single agenda is exactly what makes him more dangerous in exactly these ways. His Christianisticism is fanatical determination to be Raptured, and literally to hell with the rest of us. I cannot lose the image of him, backed by his wimminfolk, clad in a bomber jacket, staring defiantly into the DPRK from the Korean DMZ on his first Easter weekend in office. It was he who worked to get a nuclear holocaust started, and when God and Kim Jong Un didn’t take the cues, he abandoned the rest of the supposedly planned trip. He was incensed that the Koreans fielded joint teams at their Winter Olympics, and tried to spoil that by taking along father Warmbier. He’s how Sarah Huckabee Sanders got the job of confronting the press. He has to be the reason djt’s always-malleable attitude toward Erdogan has u-turned on the person of a missionary pastor and we’re now trying to provoke another member of NATO to start a war. No, a President P[I can’t write the whole thing out] might not manage to start a war himself, but he would be in a more direct position to provoke other unstable leaders of unstable countries to start them, and he’d like nothing better than to retaliate. And he’s impervious, because of his Rapture ideology, to the kind of flattery that the Koreans used to such irenic effect on djt.
I don’t know how we pull P out of the way too, except perhaps his collusion with Flynn. That too will be in Mueller’s report.
Mike “End Times” Pence believes that Jesus speaks to him. Pence believes the Apocalypse is part of God’s plan and can’t happen soon enough.
If Pence’s finger is on the nuclear launch button and he hears Jesus tell him to push it, Pence will. Trump is bad, but Pence is many times worse.
The Trump regime must be labeled a criminal enterprise and retroactively de-legitimized from day one. Every presidential order and every judicial appointment must be rescinded. Short of that, I say let the fire burn. Let’s look at the benefits gained so far:
The petrodollar has been dealt what appears to be a fatal blow. China, the world’s biggest economy has agreed to buy all the Iranian oil that Iran can ship on its own tankers. China, Iran, Russia, Venezuela and most of the other oil-producing states are turning their backs on the dollar-denominated system. Russia has liquidated all of its U.S. debt holdings and is stockpiling gold at a furious rate. The E.U. has threatened any company complying with the U.S. Iranian sanctions with legal action. They have also committed to establishing a new system of payments which cuts U.S. banks and the SWIFT system out of the loop. The almighty DOLLAR is poised to quickly become worthless, dragging the U.S. economy into an unprecedented abyss. The Amerikan sphere of influence has been reduced to the U.S., Israel and Saudi Arabia, with every other country in the effin world in opposition. Trump has brought this sordid empire closer to collapse quicker and more efficiently than any opposition group could have ever hoped. A train wreck for sure, but it’s hard to feel any sympathy.
Here’s what conservative pundit George Will says: “Trump is what he is, a floundering, inarticulate jumble of gnawing insecurities and not-at-all compensating vanities, which is pathetic. Pence is what he has chosen to be, which is horrifying.”
Jury’s still out for me on Pence. After all, he personifies that base that keeps holding their nose to support Trump. And there’s a WHOLE lot about their to do list that alternately enrages and scares me. Plus, he’s even more married to those billionaires dictating the Republican agenda than Trump. But let me be clear, that does not mean I’d rather keep Trump.
Personally, I think the net that snares Trump may well snare Pence. Then we have to look at Speaker of the House. Since the only scenario allowing for possible impeachment is a blue wave, one has to consider who might be the next speaker of the House.
Yes Pence is a dope and was in a political vacuum in Indiana when he was tapped for vice prez–But remember this, after resigning, Nixon was targeted for prosecution now that he was no longer a sitting president and his hand-picked successor, Ford, for whom nobody had voted (he replaced Agnew who went to priz) gave Nixon a blanket pardon to cover his six presidential years–If Trump were to resign or get impeached, he would be a target for mucho prosecution, he and his family and biz–Pence in the white house would definitely issue Trump a blanket pardon for his whole life (which would be necessary) and thus Trump would get a get out of jail free card–This is why no Pence and Trump will just have to continue to flail around in the office, and should we all survive that, (1) the Democrats would have to win the office in 2020 handily and (2) the next president would not be a Lincolnesque figure who would offer Trump or any of his cronies pardons and (3) once out of office Trump would be prosecuted to the full extent of the law, both state and federal–Is this last scenario plausible? Certainly, but it’s a long way to go!
I agree that Pence will be caught in the dragnet that traps the prictator and his family. A few months ago I was as afraid of ending up with Ryan as prez as opposed to having Trump or Pence, but now that Ryan has announced he’s retiring all we have to worry about is who might take his place …
This idea that a US president, on a whim, can initiate a nuclear attack has no basis in fact. There is a whole lot of military personnel and machinery that would need to get on board with the president first.
No prison for Agnew.
He got a plea bargain, pled guilty for 1 year of tax evasion, paid $10,000 fine and 3 years of probation
–while making big bucks as a private business consultant, helping foreign companies hook up with Congressional power brokers.
How about Mueller snaring both trump and pence, impeachment of the two After dems win the House, and some democrat speaker moves into the White House for a couple years?
So it begins. The faux progressives and the stalwarts of the establishment unDemocratic Party hegemony begin to justify a President Pence, a necessary thing to rid them of Trump.
Of course this raises the question of why they prefer Pence over Trump? Zunes gives several reasons he does. First he dismisses Pence’s right wing religious Theocratic leanings as undoable. Here’s the real deal. The elite don’t care about such stuff. Restrictions on women’s rights, LGBT rights, and prohibition of recreational drugs doesn’t affect them, because they can just afford to side step them. For one thing they tend to live in large Blue cities on one of the coasts (East, West, Great Lakes) that will be protective even if the Feds aren’t. If that doesn’t work, well they can afford to fly to foreign countries for abortions.
It is the average person who already suffers from the Neo-Liberal / Neo-Con Complex’s economic inequality and resource wars. So what if the average person also suffers from religious tyranny? They don’t freaking care about them. They see them as only fodder for Bill Maher’s jokes.
Also Zunes says that the reason right now that unDemocratic Party is not focusing on issues but on Trump’s outrageous personality is simply because Trump has an outrageous personality and Pence doesn’t. That simply is a load of crap. PURE baloney. Trump’s outrageous personality isn’t why they voted for a vast increase in the military budget. It isn’t why they authorized the continued use of military force giving Trump a blank check on waging war. It isn’t why they voted for war criminals like Mad Dog Mattis.
Next Zunes says Pence isn’t charismatic enough to have a loyal following. Zunes says because of this he won’t get things done. This is absurd. He got right wing things done in Indiana. Why? Because he is a low key politician who knows how to work the system. Zunes dismisses that. Why? I’ll talk about that later when I examine the real reasons the elite prefers Pence. Pence also says he is less re-electable than Trump because he doesn’t have the rabid fan base of Trump. This is the most absurd thing in the article. So the rabid fan base of Trump will just shake their hands and let the people who kicked out their President (as they would say for no good reason) take over in the next election because Pence is a bit dull. More likely they’ll be more activated and motivated than they are now. If Pence doesn’t get in front of their parade and start putting a Drum Major’s baton up and down in front of them, they’ll just find someone who will, who will be worse than Trump, and who’ll wipe Pence into smithereens in the Primary and then trounce HRC or Biden or Booker or Harris or Warren.
So why do the elite want Pence instead of Trump when Pence is a more doctrinaire conservative, a religious fanatic, and a more saavy insider politician? Well I already told you that they feel this way because they don’t care about the damage he’ll do to the average person’s rights. But what they do care about is that he won’t butt heads with the American Imperial Project the way Trump said he would and at times still seems he might. Pence will give them their war with Russia (They want a big Cold War, but it might end up Hot.) Pence will give them regime change anywhere they want.
Now Trump isn’t what he promised on foreign affairs and he’s much more willing to work with the Neo-Cons than he fooled many into thinking. But he’s still not the fellow they want for two reason: He’s not fully bought into their agenda and two, when he is bought in, he takes off the mask of American Imperialism and shows how God Damn Ugly it really is. In other words he doesn’t speak softly and carry a big enough stick. Or, you could say, he doesn’t wear the velvet glove but his hand isn’t as iron hard as they want.
Now, I don’t accuse Zunes of all these real reasons. I don’t know Zunes well enough to accuse him of this. He might just really believe the stuff he’s been sold and then a useful person to sell it to us. Or he might only be a manipulator instead of also manipulated. It doesn’t matter. My critique isn’t about him; it’s about the argument.
President Pence would be a worse thing.
(This doesn’t mean Trump shouldn’t be impeached for high crimes if he’s actually done them, just that the good of making him pay is worth getting a worse president and a rabid right up in arms, which was Zunes’ first point that I didn’t challenge. But I’m also not saying Trump should be impeached. I’m just not commenting on that question.)
Don’t worry - the Koch brothers will direct Pence in everything that he needs to do to ensure their agenda. It is truly their dream come true.
If Trump goes - Pence is in the line of succession by law. Now - what did he know about Trump’s illegal and unethical behavior? I’m sure his behavior has not been all like a choir boy or he wouldn’t have made it this far in politics. Perhaps he is a more priestly than we think.
Now if Agnew had been poor and black it would have been another story. The oligarchy takes care of its own. Its much worse than the mafia ever was.
Maybe its time that Trump called in Bill Clinton as a consultant on impeachment issues. I’m sure they could work something out and that they would both feel “our” pain.
Yes, just like Nixon, Agnew came out of Watergate losing nothing more than the office held (upon being paroled), however, getting rid of Agnew before Nixon was dumped gave us Ford, an evil indeed, but a lesser evil than Agnew.
Lets hope Mueller has something on Pence that will enable him to be dumped before Trump is dumped.
I agree that focusing on issues would be a nice change rather than the clown in office. But the US corporate media is notorious for de-emphasizing what’s important to the Left or totally ignoring our issues. Therefore, I’m not so convinced Pence is any better. He could be worse even. The rest of the contentions in this article are not even worth commenting on.
The popular choice is between a boring Christofascist or an entertaining Mafioso and we already had a dumber version of the former.