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Liberals Strike Back... Against Single Payer


I’d just like to point out that for some of us, single-payer is incrementalism. It’s not the end goal, only the first step toward truly socialized healthcare.


Medicare is the starting point for the proposed system of guaranteed healthcare that eliminates insurance company premiums, deductibles and co-pays. Improving it as outlined here means eliminating the privatized elements that the industry-based system has imposed (co-pays, Medi-Gap policies, Part D private plans and especially egregious the extra payments given to the insurers for the less costly Medicare Advantage patients). The same mix of payment types would continue. Expanding it to cover everybody eliminates the inequitable tiers of coverage and quality that exist now based on how much you can afford to pay. Improving and expanding Medicare is a relatively straightforward transition that keeps the VA, and improves the Indian Health Service, because it represents an upgrade from the services accessed through means-tested Medicaid, which is the primary federal health program for many native people. For a fiscal analysis of how to pay for such a program at the state level see this from PERI at a UMass-Amherst at HealthyCA website.


I have been calling, sending e-mails, and also visiting a district office with an indivisible group to thank my Democratic representatives for fighting against repeal of Obamacare and tell them to keep fighting. They need encouragement to stand up to the Republicans and know many of us are behind them.


I supported Obama. Did he stand for nothing?


With the attempt to repeal Obamacare finally over (hopefully) maybe the Democrats and Republicans can actually work together and fix that flaw and others. That is how the government is supposed to work but it occurs so infrequently it is hard to remember how is should work.


You have been so blinded and suckered by the libertarian propaganda that you cannot see the truth … and the reality of the existing situation in the USA.

The capitalist free market system has landed us in the shit hole we are now in where the people in the USA pay far, far more for far inferior health care.

The problem is quite simple regarding the capitalist free market system as it relates to health care in the USA today … the system profits by keeping people sick and addicted to their drugs. There is no profit to be made if we aren’t sick or don’t take their drugs.

Go ahead and bend your knee in subservience to the almighty fucking dollar. I choose a system that serves mankind instead of the friggin’ dollar and the soulless capitalist elites.

I am a U.S. expat living in a major city in South America in Ecuador that provides constitutionally guaranteed public health care for its citizens alongside affordable private health care if desired. All the medical professionals serve both systems … side-by-side.

I have been hospitalized seven times in my life. My last two times have been here in Ecuador of which my experience has been multiple times more superior than the care I received in the USA.

I have recently been diagnosed with a non-cancerous brain tumor the size of a golf ball that is located at the absolute worst place on my brain stem. The risks involved in the treatment are quite high. You cannot even fathom how thankful I am that I am here in Ecuador and not in the USA.

With the premiums, deductibles, and co-pays of any health insurance plan in the USA; this event would be financially catastrophic. The total cost of of this event (hospital, surgery, all doctors, MRIs, and 5 years of annual MRI rechecks) will be be under $10,000. I am paying this out of my own pocket (I do not carry private insurance) since I am choosing private care in a public cancer treatment center as that is what my public/private neurosurgeon recommends.

What do you suppose all this health care service would cost in the USA … $30,000, $50,000, $80,000 or more? By the way, the vast majority of my doctors received their specialty medical degrees in Europe.

My family doctor received his training in Cuba. I’ve never had a more thorough, professional. knowledgeable and caring (personal phone calls to me at my home to follow up) from any family doctor in my 60 years. Hell, he even makes house calls if needed at a grand total cost of $40. A regular doctor’s visit is only $35 and usually lasts for at least 45 minutes and includes one free follow-up visit.

So, you can take your greedy capitalist free-market system and go fly a kite because it is nothing but theft and a money-sucking racket to benefit the capitalist system and the capitalist elites … not the patients.


Obama stood for the corporate oligarchy, and that is ALL he stood for.


That wasn’t my take on Obama. I think he believed that if people could be brought together that we could solve many of our problems, but the Republicans were not having any of that. Certainly he believed in giving people the opportunity to make it through studying and hard work. In foreign policy he believed soft power could be effective although having inherited two wars from Bush he had to take military action. He believed he could inspire people to work toward a better world. Not only did he not stand for the corporate oligarchy or whatever you want to call it but he stood up to the coal industry to create the Clean Power Plan. While he didn’t live up to the hype he did accomplish quite a bit considering the Republicans fought him every inch of the way.


I agree with you entirely. So I would say not definitely to your question. In the original Medicare bill it mentions a guarantee of rights protected by law at least a hundred times I don’t see that at all in this bill. This is not a typical bill so I think I’m going to call my Senator and ask her what she thinks. You are right about the employer contribution listed as an excise tax. The ACA uses excise tax on businesses like tanning salons but that is in addition to the employers contribution which seems absent. So this bill needs a better analysis and debate. There are other problems as well. The federal/state responsibilities. A presidential appointment of a 15 person board. Lots of questions.


Oh, thanks very much. I never get that right. I know quite a few people that consider themselves liberals and they are nothing like robber barons.


The bill is basically a foundation and frame, absent the roof, insulation, siding, and drywall. You can say ignore this stuff, but in the end, it will matter. Right now, it’s more a message bill than anything. Lots of bills get introduced like it every year. That said, I do take heart the message is getting out there.


I think you are right, there should not be a vote on this in its current state. This involves some of the greedest people on the planet so you can’t have any blank spaces or issues not defined. It is a fairly decent first step.


Thanks very much for the link. I read the abstract and look forward to some additional reading. I think this is quite a bit different than HR 676 which is a national single payer plan. It will be nice to compare the two. Great comments too. Thanks.


I am posting a link to the bill HR 676 so you can see that groups excluded from participation are compensated and for a billion(s) dollar industry it is very generous. Employees are compensated as well and given priority for jobs with Medicare for All. I’m not sure that is a good idea or not, they have been working in system that has been ripping us off for years and actually lowered the standard of healthcare. This bill is to eliminate that type of behavior. Any way, you can read the bill and decide for yourself.


When you are pitching for Medicare-4-All please remember to include the 8 to 9 million non-military 'merikans living outside the borders of the US in the 4-All. All together, expats would be the 13th largest state in the country. Currently, choosing to retire outside the USA (because I can’t afford not to) means you lose access to Medicare. You are a non-citizen despite a lifetime of working and paying taxes in the US. Also remember that obtaining healthcare outside the USA means lower costs. My European buddies and their families all have access to their country’s healthcare systems and either make fun of or feel sorry for how badly my government treats me.


"and what the dominant institutions are able willing to provide."


Single payer is a tried and tested medical system as opposed to our medical kleptocracy.


You are absolutely correct, Holygeezer.


Clinton signed three pieces of right wing legislation that devastated working class Americans. These were NAFTA, The Telecommunications Act and Gramm-Leach-Bliley. Obama continued the betrayal. Hillary promised to do much of the same.


Keynes–In the long run, we’re all dead.

After all that mewling about privilege, this is the biggest privilege of all: to sit on your tail demanding that people wait for care. This has always been the Dems MO: Wait. Your. Turn.

But that turn never comes.