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Michael Moore's "Fahrenheit 11/9" Aims Not at Trump But at Those Who Created the Conditions That Led to His Rise


Michael Moore's "Fahrenheit 11/9" Aims Not at Trump But at Those Who Created the Conditions That Led to His Rise

Glenn Greenwald

“Fahrenheit 11/9,” the title of Michael Moore’s new film that opens today in theaters, is an obvious play on the title of his wildly profitable Bush-era “Fahrenheit 9/11,” but also a reference to the date of Donald J. Trump’s 2016 election victory. Despite that, Trump himself is a secondary figure in Moore’s film, which is far more focused on the far more relevant and interesting questions of what – and, critically, who – created the climate in which someone like Trump could occupy the Oval Office.


Americans are brainwashed from Day 1 to think the US has never done anything wrong & never will do anything wrong. I learned on Disqus that Mt Rushmore was created on Sacred Native American Land. I knew Roosevelt was a bad POTUS for starting the Spanish-American War & getting Panama to secede from Colombia to build a canal. He is on Mt Rushmore & doesn’t belong there. Neither do the other POTUS.


Before Trump, all was good in the God-blessed USA. Once our “resistance” defeats Trump, our true leaders will be restored to the helm of this great ship of state…

Corrupt lying media, corrupt politics, corporate domination of our lives and economy and politics, manipulation of our awareness and desires by sophisticated predatory marketing and propaganda, illegal wars, mass murder, the Sixth Extinction… this all started with Trump! No need to imagine an ongoing struggle against the looting class for survival of the ecology and humanity. Resist Trump and all will be well!

The USA is a force for good with a heart of gold. We just need to dump Trump! Pay no attention to the men behind the curtain…


Michael Moore’s “Fahrenheit 11/9” Aims Not at Trump But at Those Who Created the Conditions That Led to His Rise

The greatest trick the oligarchy ever pulled was to convince their liberal opposition to give up their guns…
(and their conservative supporters to arm themselves).


Anything by Morris Berman gives a good take on the real USA as opposed to the myth that is always being re-created. His general take is that it started as a Nation of Hustlers looking for get rich schemes as soon as they were landing off the boats at Plymouth Rock and has been that way since. Why America failed is a good read.

Another I have read which a person here recommended to me years ago is “Facing West , The Metaphysics of Indian-Hating and Empire Building” by Richard Drinnon.

Anything by William Blum is also very good.

The conditions for Trumps rise to power started a long time ago and in reality they guy is not a heck of a lot different then Presidents past who have been all been reformed by those “Historians” whose main purpose seems to be to keep the myth of “american greatness and Exceptionalism” alive.


I do agree that trump is not an anomaly never seen before, because all our presidents have had a horrid weirdness in certain areas.I think all presidents now are mainly interested in building their freaking libraries and trying to write their legacies… with their own facts, of course. : )
Nixon has a library—wow, but I heard that it’s hard to find much Watergate stuff there. : )
Ford is remembered for pardoning Nixon and tripping a lot.
Carter is know for Habitat for Humanity and having Reagan and Ollie North “F” him over by illegally working behind his back—I could never figure out why those sketchy guys didn’t go to jail immediately. Ronald RayGun has already lost his mind by that time.

There’s Bush the First… well at least he went to war, finished quickly and came home from Kuwait… but he kept going ------although the economy sucked and Calif had a recession. I read that he lost his second term because he didn’t know the price of milk.
Then we had Mr. Zipper -de-do-da Clinton who sounded good but was really an undercover Republican as he turned it all over to the bankers and killed Glass-Stegall…and let’s see—smiled a lot with the same open mouth smile in every photo…and disappointed a lot of people.
Then OMG President Cheney—yeah I know people thought it was Bush 2—but he just too busy saying silly things while Cheney decided things. Bush 2 dressed up on a military ship and declared "Mission Accomplished, and oh yeah–what was that actual mission Prez Cheney? Oh right you 2 awful people lied and lied, killed millions and no one has shot either of you yet----amazing–
Obama—oh my ---- given so much power from We the People and just----just----- just - looked good in a suit. But boy, did Mr. Peace Prize ever excel in bombing people over there and deporting people over here.

Now we have Trump with the similar imploding mind of RayGun, the ability to stop and start war for no reason like Bush 1 ,who also embed the troops so that NO REAL NEWS got out. Then too, Trump is as uninformed about the world as Bush 2 was and is. Has Trump been attacked by a rabbit in a river yet? Oh well, there’s no way that Trump will ever build any habitat for any humanity.
I wonder… everyone talks bout A I… maybe corporation heads and politicians should be replaced with AI robots with the best and most ethical minds of how to treat the world, the Earth and human beings—some Socrates, and maybe some Lincoln, and
all the best of ancient and modern minds of philosophy and throw in some Mark Twain for humor and fairness… and women like Lucy Stone and Hypatia and I really liked that Helen Thomas reporter --a dream --------- throw in a whole lot of honesty… I wonder if that would improve things?.


Words of Theodore Roosevelt.

Of course our whole national history has been one of expansion. That the barbarains receded or are conquered , with the attendant fact that peace follows their retrogression or conquest, is due soley to the power of the mighty civilized races which have not lost their fighting instinct and which by their expansion are gradually bringing peace into the red wastes where the barbarian peoples of the world hold sway.

Needless to say since that written in 1901 , in “The Strenous life” the USA and those “Civilized nations” have all but been in a constant State of war.


Of course, Greenwald seems to have such a negative view of the US that any attempt of analysis by him leads to a rand against the US and no real insight. I generally disregard his writing but It is interesting to try to figure out what the US has been. The US has always been getting involved involved in foreign adventures and many have been misguided. But the most important thing about the US is that has been the leader in carrying out the the values of the enlightment even though it started out as a country for slaves. And it has made a lot of progress and had been making progress up to Trump’s election. The election of Trump did change everything. The white nationalists completely reject the vales of the enlightenment and basically therefore they reject the basic vales of the US. Their goal is to transform it into an entirely different country based on a mythiical past of white European culture. They hate everything that isn’t white and European in origin and demand that government enforce this view.


I wanted to give you 10 up votes! :o) Loved your comment.


I’d add “Pagans in the Promised Land: Decoding the Doctrine of Christian Discovery” by Steve Newcomb.

One of our task is to “decode” and Newcomb provides a template and historical documentation of unparalleled quality.


could we throw in Lao Tzu and some more eastern buddies in that plan??


I saw Fahrenheit 11/9 this evening and thought it was terrific. The Flint Michigan material was especially powerful. Also, neat that the crowd at the theater here in Central Pennsylvania gave it an ovation at the end.


The question of who is the actual barbarian can be settled by looking around you to see the ubiquitous destruction done by the “mighty civilized races”.


You need to see this film. If you have, then see it again.


To have a positive view of US actions must require a very expensive set of rose-colored glasses.
Let them who have ears hear. Let them who have eyes see.


The Repug virulence worsened with Don, but that’s more on his party than him. No experience in government whatsoever, at any level?
Welcome, rating$ king.


He wasn’t President then. He served in it, but he didn’t have anything to do with it starting. He became famous leading troops there and thus became VP in 1900.


The values of the enlightment have not much to do with the guiding principle of the US society, which simply put is “predatory profit making at any cost and by any means” (which include kidnapping, enslaving, colonizing, imprisoning, exploiting humans, and bombing and destroying nature and other civilizations).


To which I would add: Remove all Presidential mugshots from our coinage and currency. How interesting that we have copied Roman imperial style not only in this, but also in our absurd capitol which resembles a Roman temple on steroids.


Perhaps the US should replace “mugshots from currency” with wildlife? It didn’t take long after Canada put a bird on their dollar for the that dollar to become known as the Loony. Wouldn’t an owl with eyes glowing in the dark on the US dollar be cool ? If it was a spotted owl the right wing noise machine would explode.

Time once again for Ray to reel in posters’ hyperbole, revisionist history and the like:

William Randolph Hearst’s fake news empire started the Spanish Murkin War. They even made a movie (Citizen Kane) about Hearst and his decades of fake news.

Trump didn’t invent fake news…he just blames everybody else for it despite Trump, the GOP and their Fox News (faux noise) originating more fake news than all other sources combined…including Hearst’s contributions to the sludge.