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Ready for Nuclear War over Ukraine?


#1

Ready for Nuclear War over Ukraine?

Robert Parry

A senior Ukrainian official is urging the West to risk a nuclear conflagration in support of a “full-scale war” with Russia that he says authorities in Kiev are now seeking, another sign of the extremism that pervades the year-old, U.S.-backed regime in Kiev.


#2

Yeah, and there are lunatics elsewhere too. A nuke exchange is not going to happen. If it didn't happen over Nikita Sergeevich's plan to put ICBMs in Cuba, it's not going to happen over Ukraina either.

(Given that one nuke would put paid to Ukraina as a modern nation, if dropped on Kiev, either this is a hyperbolic interpretation or Minister Prystaiko wants locking up)

But Parry is another US exceptionalist, it seems: Yet, instead of working out a plan for a federalized structure in Ukraine or even allowing people in the east to vote on whether they want to remain under the control of the Kiev regime

Why should Kiev do that? It's their damned land! This is the same kind of thinking that urges a "two-state solution" in Palestine: let the invaders keep half of what they stole!

If the ethnic Russians and main-chancers want to live in Russia, let them move there! I'm sure Kiev would be willing to pay relo.


#3

It's their damned land!

All of Ukraine belongs to Western Ukraine? Easten Ukranians have been there for a long time. Im pretty sure they would disagree.

Perhaps its the other way around. Perhaps Western Ukraine belongs to the Eastern Ukranians. After all, they could probably march across and take it now. Maybe those who want to be part of the USA should move there.


#4

We'll meet again:


#5

More "half-a-loaf" journalism from Parry.

The underlying truth that the US/NATO/IMF 100% backed and fabricated the current neo-nazi-infested Kiev junta "government" is not mentioned? How can a perspective like Parry's avoid even a mention of the pre-Maidan $5billion "regime change/NGO" cash contributed DIRECTLY by the US, administered by Assistant Secretary of State Victoria Nuland? Ya, Nuland of "our man Yats" and "f**k the EU" phone conversation fame? Paid for the neo-nazi snipers who killed both non-violent protesters and police?

Explain to the class why a hi-tech counter-mortar-radar system personally delivered by Kerry (serial numbers match US-gov't release documents) to Kiev, was found abandoned by the junta army in the Devbalsevo Caldron? Apparently brand new, never used? And how about the eastern North America accented "get out of my face" military man videoed in the Donbas, where Obama claims there are no US/NATO "boots on the ground"? Your tax dollars at work US citizens.

Also bear in mind the "Maidan" turned violent when the ELECTED Ukraine gov't decided to take a better loan offer from Russia (more money, no austerity) than the economy-busting EU/IMF/Soros deal.

Parry needs to step beyond "permissible dissent" and tell the whole truth.


#6

They've been there a long time only because of colonialism, and they don't constitute a majority as far as I can determine.

This poll is almost certainly crooked, but I don't know yet how to evaluate how crooked. Nor can I find any better, contradictory evidence. Can you?

According to the results of a poll by the Democratic Initiative of Ukraine released today [12 April 2014] and discussed by Andrey Illarionov in an Ekho Moskvy blog post, 89 percent of the residents of Ukraine consider that country their Motherland.

The poll, conducted in March and having a margin of error under 2.3 percent, found that the regional variation on this point was far less than Putin and many commentators in the West have suggested. Thus, 97 percent of the residents of the western Ukraine view that country as their own, 89 percent of the residents of the Donbas in the eastern part do as well.

Few in Ukraine support separatism. Only eight percent of the residents of the country as a whole favor separatism and joining another state, with the figures ranging from under one percent in western Ukraine to a high of 18 percent in the Donbas. And the same pattern holds about the formation of an independent state in the south east.Only 11 percent of the Ukraine’s population as a whole support that idea. Only 10 percent in the south itself back it, and only 10 percent in the East do so. In the Donbas, that figure rises to 18 percent, still less than one resident in five.

And few support joining southeastern Ukraine to Russia: only 9.5 percent in the south back it, only 11 percent in the east do so, and only 27 percent in the Donbas.

Even fewer want to see their region exit from Ukraine and become an independent state: six percent for Ukraine as a whole, two percent in the western portions of the country, and 17 percent in the Donbas, the poll found.


#7

Though a nuclear war over the Ukraine is unlikely, times have changed a lot since the Cuban missile crisis. At that time the corporate highjacking of democracy was not yet complete as many politicians still placed the public interest over those of the MIC and Big Oil. At present our collection of special interest fuelled millionaires in D.C. have far less insight into geopolitical affairs than in any time preceding them as they take their cues from a handful of corporate approved 'Think Tanks' and march in lockstep with our corporate sponsored mainstream media. The fact that most Americans are unaware of the CIA/NED sponsored coup, the accession of Neo-Nazis in the Ukraine or the corporate agendas behind the conflict, a sudden reckoning of these facts would still do next to nothing in changing the course of the conflict. Today's plutocracy will not waver in its commitment to destabilize the region regardless of 'public opinion'.
I suspect that the mysterious snipers that targeted both sides of the protests in Kiev were CIA sponsored contractors, but none of us have had definitive proof of this. However we do have definitive proof that Neo-Nazi battalions are at the forefront of this ethnic cleansing campaign and that the U.S. is in a rush to supply the only type of aid they ever supply... weapons of mass slaughter. The MSM's refusal to convey these sinister developments should be proof to even the most right wing cynics that Washington is backing the wrong side. Instead the MSM narrative remains unchanged and the situation in the Ukraine continues to spin out of control.


#9

Actually I have to disagree with you on this one. The 17% of Ukrainians who are ethnic Russians are just as much Ukrainians as the other 83%. If French Canadians decided to separate from Canada, would Anglo-Canadians have the right to wage war against them? Though many Canadians would be sad to see Quebec separate, the logical thing to do, would be to let them have their own autonomy rather than engage in a civil war. The situation in the Ukraine is no different. As in Canada, both sides need to work "out a plan for a federalized structure" in the Ukraine as Parry suggests rather than sinking further into an irrational civil war. This does not necessarily mean a two state solution (Anglo and Franco Canadians do NOT have a two state solution), nor does it instantly translate into independence for Russian-Ukrainians. What is does mean though, is a conscious effort by both sides not to be manipulated by outside parties.


#13

It's quite different: Quebec hasn't a Donbas, and Francophones are a majority there. In Eastern Ukraina, the separatists are not, as far as I can determine, a majority, so what they're doing and trying to do has no support under international law.


#15

With due respect, you apparently are not familiar with Robert Parry's pieces on Ukraine, All of the subjects you mentioned have been covered by Mr. Parry over and over again. His site is called Consortium News and you will find dozens on Ukraine. Here is one I just quickly found on how the New York Times has its head in the sand over the Nazi element that brought about the coup.

https://consortiumnews.com/2015/02/11/nyt-whites-out-ukraines-brown-shirts/


#16

I know you're a regular here, so it is dumbfounding that you make those claims against Parry. Unless I am mistaken it was Parry that reported all of those things you mentioned, posted on this very site. As this situation continues to develop it is nuts to expect him to regurgitate, with every new article, that which he and others have already firmly established.


#17

Given the lunatic nature of Kiev leadership I guess we can finally put to rest who is responsible for the downing of the airliner.

Hey, it worked for the Bushites and their 9/11 moles leading the herd of sheep into the regional disaster in the Mid-East. Imitation is the truest form of flattery.


#20

I listened to the press conference "Strelkov" gave about the shootdown of the airliner and thought to myself that he's not as smart as he should be to be an ex-polkovnik in PVO Strany, even in a reserve regiment. And nowhere near as bright as a GRU officer needs to be. His crudely disingenuous responses should have had the reporters pinning him to the wall, but evidently that's too much to expect from what passes for journos in the US these days.


#22

Ya, I regularly read Parry's work, as he sometimes adds important details not found elsewhere. But find he, like so many other US-based writers, avoid stepping over the line to speak clearly and completely on many US transgressions. Whether self-limited by personal beliefs or the desire to maintain access to sources and column inches in the major outlets, the result is the same. He often doesn't include ALL the salient facts, just enough to be called "progressive". Keeps him on the right side of "allowable dissent".

But consider the idea of taking the good info where we find it, even if buried in untruths and obfuscation. We don't throw out Newton's Laws of Motion because he was also an alchemist. Likewise, I appreciate Parry when he's making good points, but despair when he stops short of the whole truth or defaults back to subtle US jingoism.

If you want an unvarnished look at mainstream media to model your critical skills on US media, check out medialens.org from the UK. Given the UK media follows basically the same US/NATO script as the US media, you may be amazed to discover just how limited even "progressive" media is.


#23

It doesn't take much to briefly make that extra step, to tie up the whole parcel. I have the same issue with most US-based "progressive" writers, they can't seem to see the US as the rest of the world does, so fall short of telling the whole story.

A comfortable intellectual prison is still a prison. The US public needs some shock therapy to comprehend the depths to which US machinations are hated world wide. They don't hate you because of your freedoms. They hate you because you deny them theirs.

The core of these issues in the US/NATO desperation to defend the corrupted and bankrupt Bretton Woods/IMF/WTO/World Bank/US$-reserve-currency system. To that end they instigate regime change and war to derail the BRICS+/SCO/multi-currency project.

Parry merely needs to append a couple short sentences linking my previous two sentence to whatever information he is presenting.

All US "progressive" writers should be regularly referring to the BRICS+ project as opposition to the Bretton Woods system and basic cause of US agrression, but it is almost NEVER mentioned? WHY NOT?

Because they know which side their journalistic bread is buttered on.


#24

The overwhelming proof that it was a Ukraine military SU25 that intentionally shot MH17 down has long been known, all physical, electronic and eyewitness evidence agrees. Only the US/NATO media still pushes the BUK-missile and other concocted lies.

Lusitania, the Maine, Gulf of Tonkin... the list of US false flag provocations inciting war or regime change is well over 100 items long.


#25

Parry is a gem on this subject if only because he lambasts the idiocy (and danger) of today's Official Narratives. Most of these are brought to U.S. by the same operators who pushed the pre-fab agenda for war against Iraq on the basis of equally delusional (contrived deceptions, all) notions.

As to this idea of "who benefits?" one would naturally answer: The Military Industrial Complex.

The same minds that saw a logic in M.A.D (Mutually Assured Destruction) or this level of idiocy, "I knew my god was bigger than his" (General Boykin) also see a logic in all-out war. Again.

Whenever The People become unruly because the centuries' old legion of oligarchs has found ways to claim too much of the world's resources for themselves, instead of practicing fairness and working in accord with the established laws of the land, they use WAR as an offset.

I hope it plays differently this time. Deja vu is getting old when it's conducted by Mars' minions.


#26

You can't see past your own prejudices.


#29

Not so much the Ukraine, but the US installed and backed puppet regime were most likely instructed by the CIA to shoot it down for the west to blame on Russia. Which they did. Generating plenty of propaganda.

The false flag has been one of the empire's favorite tricks. Again and again we see dirty deeds carried out in order to blame the one who is to be the target of western propaganda. The false flag in Syria was used to justify the destruction of yet another nation, and was only disproved later.


#30

And are the USA ones fake? Does the empire poison its victim countries with fake D.U.? Were those fake nuclear weapons used by the pre-empire USA in Nagasaki and Hiroshima?