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#SnowdenTreaty: To Honor NSA Whistleblower, a Pact to End Mass Spying


#1


#2

I totally support this initiative, but I am wondering why no mention was made of Julian Assange? If anyone paid a price for using the Internet to inform a maximum number of world citizens, he deserves THAT prize in addition to full recognition... along with privacy protections.


#3

Ask yourself how free do you feel when someone is watching you? How much can you be yourself, say what you want and just be relaxed and open ... when someone is watching you?

Do you say what you want or do you self censor by reflex. Even before electronic privacy became an issue the phrase 'in the privacy of one's home' was an accepted understanding of being a free people. But you know that your home isn't private any more.

Who watches the watchers who watch us in secret? Who are these people and who do they answer to? How free do you feel when even just talking about how we are losing our freedoms makes you nervous that somebody may be listening?


#4

Siouxrose is correct...both have served all of humanity without regards for their own safety and security...how many of us are willing to do this? Damn too few and I am including myself. Shades of Patrick Henry?


#5

Chelsea Manning is the real hero who had the courage to disclose the Iraq War Logs, Julian Assange betrayed his source, now Manning is serving 35 years hard time in a military brig as a result of the betrayal! Investigative Journalist Greg Palast was the first to honor Chelsea Manning and chastised Julian Assange for his recklessness.


#6

We've lost too much of our democracy for this kind of tactic to be effective. How many treaties does the US have that are ignored in practice? Do you know, for example, about the Kellog-Briand pact, an international agreement that outlaws ALL the US military adventures of the last 90 years? And global warming agreements, and the Human Rights Statement. These are just three of many good treaties that we are not honoring and not even saying why we are not honoring them.

Passing domestic laws doesn't seem any better. Torture is clearly unconstitutional, but it doesn't stop us. Domestic spying is, of course, explicitly forbidden to the CIA--and yet it hasn't stopped the last several administrations.

I believe that what we need is not a campaign for new treaties or new legislation. We need a people's movement to demand that our elected leaders comply with existing laws.


#7

Iceland would be a good place for Manning, Assange & Snowden. They'd live in a democratic nation & wouldn't have to worry about being sent somewhere else for prosecution.


#8

i just say what i'm gonna say. now i suppose if i was involved in secret planning to pull off some cool subversive civil disobedience, i'd have to start using snail mail and face-to-faces or learn encryption. but for now, i say, to heck with them.


#9

Read and listened for years to Greenwald back when he posted on Salon prior to removing himself to Brazil with a kind of paranoia not really normal. Will take a great more information to support such a "treaty?" for me to believe the statements of anyone, but Chesea Manning who too the fall while the rest hid out. Not sure Snowden shouldn't join her along with Assange and his supporters who are apparently paying his way to live in the Embassy in London.

Do I support "mass spying?" Who would? But this cast of characters doesn't get it for me.


#10

I was talking about ordinary day to day life not secret anything. When other people are watching we all become self conscious and begin to say and act differently. Like a teacher in a classroom self censoring rather than bring up a subject like say evolution or the overthrow of Allende by AT&T/Kissinger/junta etc.

How in a future age or even now how people will become reluctant to visit 'controversial' sites that question the status quo and so forth. Where people are reluctant to speak freely in opposing war or anything else that the right objects to.

That is where we are headed if privacy is lost to us. Self censorship because people will be afraid to be free. They need a sense of privacy to be a free people. The right can say what they want but there are no free societies that exist under constant surveillance.

Big Brother will always insist that you are free.


#11

hmm. i don't know. i get the feeling that if we could have spirited Chelsea away from the military's tentacles, she might have been happy to get out of Dodge. No one realized how vicious they would be when the whole thing began, i don't think. i do think they are all heroes.

nice thing about CD--opinions? we got 'em! :O)


#12

And Chelsea Manning, who pretty much lit this thing off!
;-})


#13

Assange has been treated abysmally. He is a hero. But America decides who the heroes are, don't they?


#14

Do you realize that anyone under fifteen years of age has never known privacy?
* To them, endless surveillance is normal, There has never been, for them, a private phone call, e-mail, skype, or computer usage such as facebook or twitter.
* Ask a student a question about the Constitution or the Bill of Rights. You get a blank look.
* I hope I'm wrong, but my impression is that a lot of kids would say, "That's cool!" when they hear of yet another new spy method. They no longer know any better. It has become the norm.
;-})


#15

This is well overdue. Household appliances that one can talk to are now being produced and work by the advertising industry on computerised emotion-recognition is underway. The aim of the latter is that when viewing adverts and products your emotions can be judged in real time by computer so that you can be persuaded gently by the advertisement to buy what the advertiser wants you to buy. Article in New Scientist recently. George Orwell's Thought Police had nothing on this in regards to potential in surveillance; Orwell's screens had to have people, not computers, looking at what you were doing and how your face reacted to the image of Goldstein.


#16

The principle problem with universal surveillance is that we do have people looking at what you do and at how your face reacts. Computer algorithms sort out what the people-watchers want and then the results are the focus for snap, frequently illogical and immoral judgments. These people are not Spock-like Vulcans; they are SS, FBI, CIA "operatives" and frequently local, poorly educated sheriff's deputies. It's still the people. We must emphasize the formation of conscience, ethical responses, and not depend on such rash generalizations as all police, firemen, soldiers are our heroes. Snowden, Manning, Assange, Daniel Ellsberg, MLK, JFK, RFK are models, not without faults, but of superior consciences and ethics. We need pay no lip service to ethics. But as transparent men and women, practice ethical principles in stressful situations. It's always lonely at the mountaintop.


#17

I'd like to see just one of the talking head "interviewers" ask the Prez candidates about their views on Snowden, Assange and Manning. But I know that all "interviews" and photo ops are very carefully planned...