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WATCH: Naomi Klein and Shoshana Zuboff Discuss Mounting Dangers of 'Surveillance Capitalism'

WATCH: Naomi Klein and Shoshana Zuboff Discuss Mounting Dangers of 'Surveillance Capitalism'

Common Dreams staff

A live-streamed discussion about "the unprecedented form of power called 'surveillance capitalism' and the quest by corporations to predict and control our behavior" featuring Naomi Klein, a senior correspondent for The Intercept, and Harvard Business School professor emerita Shoshana Zuboff is planned for Friday evening.

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No - nothing here.

As out of touch, both, as the inhabitants of Mar a Lago.

Can you be more clear what you mean?

The commodification of the human mind and social ecology and the resulting alienation of humans from their own minds, by means of the internet, is capitalism’s next logical step after the commodification of a human’s skillful hands and sweat and resulting alienation from their own bodies by means of the capitalist’s industrial mills and mines of the 19th century.

Marx would be amazed at the technology that made this next stage of capitalism possible, but not at all surprised at the result.

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Again, this hidden surveillance capitalism is extremely dangerous. As Professor Zuboff explains–it is against autonomy, against democracy. It is also against what libertarians like to call “liberty” and the “free market.” The global network of manipulation and control is being stitched up tight around the world. It is against every self evident right, including human creativity. Be very afraid.

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I fear not for myself in this regard as I have been inoculated by the words of Ralph Waldo Emerson’s Self Reliance (1841):

‘The power men possess to annoy me, I give them by a weak curiosity. No man can come near me but through my act. “What we love that we have, but by desire we bereave ourselves of the love.”’

Consumption is not a value of mine. I purchase mostly for need and occasionally for earned amusement. I eschew debts of both money and favor. Having studied Edward Bernays’ (1928) Propaganda and like works I know the enemy’s playbook. Having studied Sun Tzu’s The Art of War, I know how to respond.

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Its a Pandora’s box that has been wide open for decades. The time to end this was the first moment we learned of it - but there was not a whisper of opposition to be heard anywhere in the halls of government. Instead people like Snowden and Assange have to hide in exile for exposing the high treason that every member of our government eagerly participated in.Thank you democrats, for your unswerving and willful support of the uprising fascist regime. Thank you progressives for your unswerving support of the democrats. you can close the lid now, everything that was going to come out is already out, and you can’t put the genie back in the bottle.

Also want to thank folks similarly for their equal support on every single other important issue without a single exception. Good looking out!

Also I would like to make an honorable mention from our moral leadership in the churches across the nation. Remarkable restraint there, i don’t think the universe ever witnessed such a profound silence, not counting voting night down in the republican voting district. Nice moral leadership there, not a single recorded incident of disapproval on any front, even while you aggressively proclaim major support of the fascists every second minute of each of your sermons. I wonder how much of you untaxed tithings end up at the GOP super PAC. Goodbye, The end, over and out.

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Profit driven evolution. We are now the product for sale.

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The next step will be outright police state. The capitalistic mindset requires background information. This sort of personal data gathering started early on right alongside computing sophistication and data banking. Trading personal information as a commodity has been going on for decades now. It happened when businesses got a hold of our private data in exchange for loans, public utilities, hospitals, eye exams etc, etc…just about everyone wants our Id’s. Now a days software programs have capabity to make predictions maybe not very accurate ones yet but like everything else it gets smarter in time. We are in their fangs with little time to wiggle ourselves out and put the gene back in the bottle. If unopposed those in position of data will in a relatively little time have total power over all aspects of our life and death.

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Well, I predicted all of this, especially when most Americans all just so easily caved and gave in to their irrational and hysterical fear of every single Muslim person right after 911, and far too many Americans and our elected representatives especially were all too willing to just go along and vote for and allow the passage of the treasonous Patriot Act, a bill that had all been written long before 911 had ever occurred, and that was all planned and all ready so as to have the NSA turn all of the government spy and surveillance cameras right around to spy on every single innocent American citizen, instead of and in addition to it’s usual previous job of spying only on foreign officials. The republicans in the Bush administration all said that they had no choice but to do this just to “keep us all safe,” right after the trauma of 911 which of course conveniently facilitated its passage into law, and then the democrats did not dare to oppose this bill, fearing that had they done so and opposed it, that perhaps the NSA would not be able to prevent any further terrorist attacks, making them responsible for any future potential loss of life, and so they foolishly all voted for it, and so these democrats unwittingly threw away our privacy and perhaps even our safety from any governmental overreach forever. And then, in order to accomplish this massive spy campaign on every American citizen, it required that massive computer storage facilities be built so as to house all of this massive amount of data, costing many billions of taxpayer dollars, and then this required that 1,400 private companies were contracted by the government to build all of these massive computer storage facilities and they also built a massive spy complex to coordinate and control and sort through all of the massive reams of data that they now collected on EVERY single American citizen. And they dared to do all of this without having any probable cause or warrant and then even allowed much of this data to be used by these for profit companies for marketing purposes. And because of all of this massive abuse of every last bastion of our privacy was all taken away, even when none of this surveillance could ever keep us safe or do anything for our own benefit whatsoever, as it did nothing to prevent the Boston Marathon attacks. And in fact all of this governmental surveillance does exactly the opposite of keeping us safe because we are now at the mercy of a government without any mercy, and we are now easily the victim of every single unscrupulous government official. I’m sick to death of so many massively wimpy Americans who always seem to mindlessly believe and always will overreact and succumb to every kind of fear and every manufactured fake crisis just because it appears in the media, all without questioning any of it for veracity, or doing any research or fact checking to verify what the media tells us. And far too many Americans succumb to every newly touted popular fear spoken of by the media, like immigrants carrying smallpox when smallpox was completely eradicated worldwide in 1977, and all while completely ignoring a whole number of very real things that we all ought to truly fear, things like America’s for profit military-prison-industrial-surveillance state, climate change, nuclear waste, our massive taxpayer funded illegal biological and chemical weapons facilities that are endangering all of our public health and safety, the pollution caused by every kind of toxic chemical and heavy metal pollution that is regularly dumped into our drinking and bathing water, the massive overuse of neurotoxic pesticides, creeping dictatorial, totalitarian fascism, and the erosion of all of our freedoms, and more.

This outrageous governmental overreach has even gotten to the point that today any person over age 65 who becomes mentally ill, unconscious, or mentally incapacitated for any reason and who is ever hospitalized for any reason can now have their custody be forcibly taken away from their husband or from their family members by some unscrupulous psychiatrist making a false report to DHS, and then be forcibly given ECT in order for the psychiatrist to receive a $25,000 payment from Medicare for giving any person over the age of 65 ECT. This evil psychiatrist had called DHS to investigate these family members on absolutely phony and trumped up charges, for only committing the “horrible sin” of daring to simply QUESTION the need for their mother to receive ECT at all, only because they had wondered why this psychiatrist had even wanted to use ECT at all on this frail medically ill, and elderly person who was not suffering from any depression at all but only from dementia, kidney failure and cardiac arrhythmias. So then because DHS had become involved, DHS tried to do nasty and unscrupulous things so as to malign these family members any way that they could, refusing to allow any family members to even visit their mother, even her own grandchildren, and they even refused to allow the mother to even see her own minister! Then, DHS got a judge to appoint a temporary guardian over their loved elder and so terminated the ability of anyone in the family to do anything to advocate for their own mother, or to be involved with her care in any way. This was all only supposed to be just until they could fight to gain custody of their own mother back by getting a lawyer and fighting DHS and trying to get their mother to be put in the custody of a family member instead, but their mother had eventually died before the case was ever adjudicated. This temporary custody was then taken over by some unscrupulous person who was appointed as a “temporary guardian” by the court until the permanent guardianship could be adjudicated requiring the family to hire lawyers to fight this abuse. And then the temporary guardian went ahead and allowed the psychiatrist to force this frail elderly person over eighty five years of age, to undergo ECT against her will, and against the will of the entire family, all which was done only so that the psychiatrist could receive a $25,000 fee paid for by Medicare, by using a dubious and wholly made up psychiatric diagnosis that was created by this very same greedy, and very unscrupulous psychiatrist. And so, after forcibly administering ECT to this poor elderly woman, the patient suffered harm and then so because this use of ECT had caused irreversible harm to this elderly person, all because she had cardiac and other medical contraindications and never should have ever been given ECT in the first place, and so as to cover up this medical malpractice, the hospital psychiatrist denied ever administering any ECT even though there was clear evidence of her having done so, and so the psychiatrist then destroyed 15 pages in the mother’s medical records, stating that they had just “gotten lost,” and then the state guardian then had this now even more helpless elder be forcibly placed in a nursing home where she was neglected and just left to die, because the staff did not keep her properly hydrated and did not offer her liquids, until it got to the point that she had become severely dehydrated, and the nursing home staff also left her lying for hours without ever turning her so that then this elderly person also got a massive bedsore in only two weeks time after being there and it was so horrible that it caused her to even suffer septic osteomyelitis, and to have to have this decubitus debrided. So between the dehydration and the decubitus, this caused her to be hospitalized again, this time in a different hospital where the attending doctors were then very angry about all of her obvious mistreatment, and then she was placed in a different nursing home where she finally died two weeks later. During this entire time the family members were prevented from ever visiting her or from getting any access to their elderly mother’s bank account so as to pay for her burial, and they then had to take out a loan to get their mother buried, even though there was supposed to have been money in her account for this purpose. And then the family found out later, after the funeral, that in the end DHS or the temporary guardian or someone had taken all of this elderly person’s assets, and had not even left her family with enough money with which to bury her! Then the family finds out that the state or the guardian or some unknown person or persons had also taken and sold this elderly person’s home and had kept all of the money and the guardian had even taken all of the money out of all of her bank accounts, and the guardian and DHS then refused to give the family or even their lawyer any accounting at all of where the money had gone or what it had even been used for, leaving the family in debt for the funeral costs, and for expensive legal fees. During this entire time the family had been made completely powerless to be able to stop any of this real elder abuse that had been perpetrated on their mother by this psychiatrist, by the guardian, and by DHS, all the while THEY were treated as if THEY had been the abusers! And then afterwards when they contacted lawyers to try to sue for all of this abuse, they then find out that they cannot even sue anyone for any redress afterwards due to this particular state’s protective malpractice laws. And so because of the cost of all of this legal assistance, and because of the power of the state and of its agencies, and because of the power and influence of these hospitals and doctors there was nothing that the family could ever do about it!

This is nothing short of egregious elder abuse, negligent homocide or worse. It is also Medicare fraud, psychiatric malpractice and robbery of a member of America’s frail elderly population of the very worst possible kind. It even appears that the judges who operate these state courts couldn’t care less, and nothing yet at all is being done about it! So beware, and take some legal precautions before you or any older person or any person who has ever had a mental health diagnosis in your family, especially any older woman who might ever be vulnerable to any of this massive and what truly ought to be criminal governmental robbery, exploitation, and murderous elder abuse and malpractice takes place! My poor best friend just lost her mother in exactly this way when her mother, an elderly woman with dementia had been given excellent care by her family at home for many years, and had no bedsores, no bruises, no injuries, and was well hydrated and well fed and had been very happy with her grandchildren around her at home and she had only gone to the hospital for symptoms related to a cardiac arythmia, even though she had had a past history of BiPolar but has been stable on her meds for many years. There was no indication at all to ever give ECT to this woman, she was not depressed, and she had medical contraindications to ECT and so she suffered injury because of being given ECT against her will and against the will of her family. And it is absolutely unbelievable that this kind of abuse is even possible to have happen to anyone or to any family member living here in America! The state or someone seems just to want to get ahold of frail elders so that they can exploit them and to commit Medicare fraud and then to neglect and abuse them and rob them of all of their assets, and then to blame and shame and rob their innocent families as well! Something needs to be done about this!

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“Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.”

Benjamin Franklin

This means you Americans! According to one of the most important and influential founders of your nation , you deserve neither liberty nor safety!

The term Anti - American in fact applies when noting the actions of the right wing terrorist organization and crime syndicate known as The United States Government.

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My Republican friends, to a person, respond to this issue with " I’ve got nothing to hide".

My response back to them has been:
They’ve got you answering the wrong question. The question is NOT “do I have anything to hide”. The question is “Do I Have Anything To PROTECT” and you are answering NO to that.

They don’ talk about this in front of me anymore.

It’s not a Party. It’s a suicide Cult

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Omg, you should definitely consider writing a book. I promise I’ll buy the first copy

Nice I hear that too from time to time and know how to respond now" thanks

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The issue is the future of all of us. Thank gods for Russia and China for having recognized the Yankee snake. They pulled 911 with assistance from Israel, Saudi Arabia and Pakistan. “Vice” still around, we ought to stop him for some questioning.

Here is the video that was supposed to be available in the article:

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That would leave us with the uncomfortable decision of who to rebuke first, and remove the threat. Once one gang is formed, a rival gang or two suddenly appear. Boy, ain’t we got fun?
Nothing like distraction while they are picking your pockets.

I think all of these war criminals have a ton of dirt on most government officials, which makes Kissinger and Cheney and others untouchable.

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I’ve thought about this for a while now, beyond the obvious advertising propaganda.
Recall the movie in which a pair of sunglasses are found that when worn exposes the alien brainwashing of a matrix.
Well, today we have a similar matrix, the aliens replaced by capitalists, and the people are the people. Duped by a film of deceit. But we don’t need magic glasses to see what’s going on, if we take a little time and effort to recognize that we are being milked by vampires that live off of greed.
And an important video to watch. Thanks.

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Surveillance Capitalism on steroids?:

Thanks!