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What Should Be An Entirely Unnecessary News Flash For Kavanaugh: Contraception Is Not Abortion


#41

You are hiding behind semantics. Limiting the definition of abortion to the ending of a pregnancy (after implantation) ignores the fact that the pill can and does end the life of the fertilized egg by preventing it from implanting and developing as it otherwise would.


#42

That’s funny, I could have sworn it was biology that tells us that at conception the egg and sperm combine to form one cell with a full set of DNA, different than the DNA set of either parent, that this cell then develops and grows prior to the blastocyst (200-300 cells) implants.


#43

oh, and I forgot this, https://www.reuters.com/article/us-when-does-pregnancy-begin/when-does-pregnancy-begin-doctors-disagree-idUSTRE7AG24B20111117


#44

MM –

As you can see from the violence of this “Church” over more than 2,000 years their only
beliefs are in male supremacy, underpinning Elite-Patriarchy, and destruction of Nature
based in “Manifest Destiny” and “Man’s Dominion Over Nature” –

and full time exploitation of children in their care and sexual abuse of them.

Filling out a statement which says they object and signing it is a “burden” according to
the White Power Kavanaugh, but keeping a young pregnant girl in confinement so she
can’t have an abortion isn’t a “burden” according to Kavanaugh.


#45

TJ –

You are hiding behind semantics. Limiting the definition of abortion to the ending of a pregnancy (after implantation) ignores the fact that the pill can and does end the life of the fertilized egg by preventing it from implanting and developing as it otherwise would.

As you confirm here – the pill PREVENTS pregnancy from occurring by preventing any egg –
fertilized or not fertilized – from adhering to the lining of the womb.
Thus – there is NO pregnancy.
Thus – there is NO abortion.

The life of a fertilized egg – ?

How many fertilized eggs in fertility clinics are tossed away because those like you refuse to
move them into their bodies, or into the bodies of their girlfriends to save those “fertilized eggs”?

What would be of some actual value would be turning your attention to the millions of young
children whose lives are destroyed by Catholic priests sexually abusing them now and over
2000 years of this vile “church.”

How about the children living in poverty in the US while our 1% get richer every year in their greed?

How about the actual living children who the US/CIA every year are maiming, killing their
parents, destroying their homes?

Your value system continues to pound away that these lives are LESS worthy than a fertilized egg.

Get help.


#46

TJ –

Let me also remind you that the Catholic Church as it exists here is subject to the laws
and regulations – and police enforcement – which our government requires …

Meanwhile, I’m also happy to say that in New Jersey our Attorney General has opened up an investigation into the Catholic Church and sexual abuse of children by its priests … similar to what the State of Pennsylvania has recently done to look into the long history of sexual abuse of children
by priests of the Catholic Church.


#47

The medicine.net definition you cited uses the term fetus and pregnancy. If you do any reading of medical information at all you will see a fertilized egg that does not implant and gets flushed out does not meet the definition of either term. (E.g. an embryo is not a fetus)

You can be against birth control if you want, but it would be better if your camp spoke English so the rest of us can respond. You can’t change well defined terms. Make up a new word if you want or use existing words correctly.


#48

No scientist would ever suggest to you that a fertilized egg is a child –


#49

TJ –

Again …

The pill mimics Nature which regularly flushes both fertilized and unfertilized eggs from the womb.


#50

Not true


#51

Only if you define pregnancy as starting with implantation, if pregnancy starts at fertilization, than , yes the pill can cause abortions. Regardless of the definition of pregnancy used, the pill artificially ends the life of a human being. That is the core of these legal cases, not wanting to participate in this unjust killing.

Yes, fertilized eggs in storage are an issue, I don’t have an answer for what to do with them. However, you need to start with the basic premise (is a fertilized egg a human life) and work out the details of situations from there. The fact that there are problematic issues will to be addressed will not change the underlying facts.

And yes, I am concerned with the issues in the Catholic Church. As a parent with children in Catholic school, who regularly volunteers, I have been involved with working with and protecting the children in our care. I donate to charity to help those in need and I do not see how vilifying the 1% helps them in any way. I support the just use of force by our government, but that does not mean I value those lives any less.


#52

No argument from me here. I fully support AGs investigating these cases and charging offenders and those who enabled them.


#53

Not true


#54

and sometimes children stop breathing and die during the night. That doesn’t make it OK to smother them with a pillow.


#55

Are you saying a fertilized egg is not a product of conception?


#56

I didn’t say anything about the word conception, though according to Guttmacher again, the term is equivalent to pregnancy (implantation), https://www.guttmacher.org/gpr/2005/05/implications-defining-when-woman-pregnant:

At the state level, however, definitions of pregnancy—generally, as part of larger measures enacted to regulate abortion or prescribe penalties for assaulting a pregnant woman—vary widely. Some of these laws say that pregnancy begins at fertilization, others at implantation. Several use the term “conception,” which is often used synonymously with fertilization but, medically, is equated with implantation.

The text above tells me I should have been more careful when I said about Kavanaugh “Legally he is dead wrong” as this is true about federal law and the medical literature, but not about all state law (since some states are controlled by pro-lifers that will intentionally obfuscate the language).

To see how crazy it is to use the word pregnancy for pre-implantation, would a woman tell her partner, “I’m pregnant” if in a hypothetical future there is a way to know the moment an egg is fertilized and then a few days later when the fertilized egg doesn’t implant (about 1/2 the time), she says “I had a miscarriage”. A real miscarriage is usually a very stressful event. If women had this stress every time a fertilized egg didn’t implant, that would be a terrible development.


#57

Even Pope John XXIII disagrees with your religious fanaticism as he told Catholics to use their
own personal conscience and free will to decide for themselves whether or not to have an abortion.
See: Vatican II

NATURE also disagrees with your religious fanaticism as it provided numerous ways for women
to control fertility by use of plants, the knowledge of which and the plants themselves were destroyed
by Elites/Patriarchy.

How many children do you have?
You volunteer to do what?
And what do you mean by “the children in our care”?

Where did it ever make sense for the Catholic Church to “vilify” women, Jews, homosexuals, gypsies,
native Americans in their thousands of years of persecution and violence?

There’s a difference between calling the 1% to accountability for their greed and corruption
and running Crusades, Inquisitions and Burnings at the Stake.

It would be nice if we had JUST FORCE by a government – but just who do you mean by "those lives"


#58

TJ –

No argument from me here. I fully support AGs investigating these cases and charging offenders and those who enabled them.

It would be wise to stop supporting a church which has lied and sexually abused children for 2,000 years.


#59

Where does any scientist say that a fertilized egg is a child?


#60

TJ –

Nor does it make it OK for priests to sexually abuse them – or to brainwash them and
turn them into adult religious fanatics for the profit of the church.