We face a very serious political problem in this country, and that problem is manifested in a post written yesterday by Amber Phillips of The Washington Post. In her piece, Phillips criticizes me for lowering the state of our political discourse, because I accused the president of being a “liar.”
Alternative or false beliefs are the start of fascism.
Or religion. (Fascism operates through religiosity, of course.)
For me this was the best line from Bernie and thanks for bringing this issue up.
"I happen to strongly believe in civil political discourse."
However, holding our representatives to the truth is the herd that left the barn when the door was open. How do you deal with GW Bush's administration that lied to the world in front of the UN and then there was no accountability. Obama's admin. was no better. Obama told the world that Assad attacked his own people with chemical weapons. Turns out the chemical weapons probably came from Libya via HRC through Turkey into Syria. Or The overthrow of Ukraine by Nazis put on by the US and Soros.
So you can see we have history that actually goes back to our birth. Broken Native treaties.
Okay Bernie hit them hard. Where are you going to start with the arrests? I say we start with GW Bush admin. All of them. Or did you expect us to believe that only DJT as president lies? Gulf of Tonkin? 9/11? Pearl Harbor? Russia is our enemy?
Of course, none of that is ever going to happen. You want accountability why do you start here?
What do mean If, Is there any doubt about it?
Thanks Bernie, for everything you have done. You have changed US politics for generations to come. Agreed that Trump lies a lot. But it is also true that our government has officially lied in the past (Iraq WMD are just one of many examples). The mainstream press often lie, especially by omission. What are we to do about that? Unfortunately there are no referees in life. Journalists were supposed to play that role, but instead have turned to click-bait (view-bait) journalism. Now it is only about money, with a bit of corporate and government perception management on the side.
I love you Bernie, but the problem of oligarchy you so eloquently spoke of from the heart is more powerful than anything that has come before it. It is multinational, and combines business, government and the media into one fairly cohesive conglomerate that is going to be difficult if not impossible to overcome. Liberal and conservative working people need to realize that they are not natural enemies, they are two sides of a coin, and they need to work together to bring down the oligarchy. If the people let themselves be split by the oligarchs, then it is unlikely that the people will be able to regain their freedom from the oligarchs.
Of course you must call the lies, lies. The man is a malignant narcissist and a compulsive liar. He's not mentally stable as you must know but he is not a king. We have every right and duty to call him who and what he is. To remove him is the only answer.
He has ties to Putin's corruption arm through business deals that amount to money laundering. (I don't believe Russian's hacking flipped the election, they hack every country) that was all on the Dem's. Trump probably knew it was going on but his illegalities are in his financial relations, bigly.
So there's that and the fact that he is mentally unstable should be enough to get him out. Oh, wait, there's the emoluments as well. Is there still any law in this country that is enforced for the President?
I hope this country will pass this test of our democracy but given the fact the democrats are so Neoliberal and show no real desire to change I'm afraid when this is over the dem's will go back to the same old policies. This fight is bigger than Trump, it's for the life of democracy in this fascist leaning country. I pray for you and all that fight and resist every day.
Speak the truth and never stop.
Well, Bernie, you look forward to our answers.
Here is mine. You ask, " What credibility will the USA have when we need to bring countries around the world together to respond to those crises?".
My comment is, " How is the ROTW going to to respond to the crisis that is the USA?". Once that is solved, perhaps there will be far fewer crises for the USA to think it needs to deal with.
So Ms Phillips is squeamish about liars being called liars. It's so much easier to say "prevaricate," "provided alternate facts," "did not provide facts as appear obvious to many others," and other euphemisms. Doing that has actually worsened the problem, because bullies and liars thrive on the fact that those surrounding them either fall flat on their faces in abject terror, look the other way politely, or shrug off their abominable behavior. In the British parliament, they get in each other's faces and scream at each other, letting it all hang out. Maybe we should have a little less "elevated political discourse," and a little more raw honesty.
While the perpetrator of the chemical weapons incident you mention was never clear. Assad has shot, tortured and hung "his own people" by the thousands - specifically our Syrian brothers on the left.
Do you have a link? But this thread is about the epidemic of lying by US presidents. Not Assad.
Seeing how WaPo is second to none in fake news generation, Phillips' admonition is no surprise.
The only question I have for Sanders is why he asks "IF the president is a liar" when there is no if, Trump's lies have been so egregious and pervasive that if turned to when at least five years ago.
To answer Bernie's question: Reframe the 'truth versus lies' issue in Moral terms, Leadership terms, and in terms of Greatness. Go beyond countering lies with facts and fact checks; start talking about the moral courage to face what may be very difficult truths to face, and assert that strong, good, qualified leadership requires facing them.
The surprise move that Democrats and Progressives could make, and I wish would make, is that they are all for making American great, and that greatness begins with great leaders, and great leaders do not lie.
Ode to Bernie and his followers:
Workers Unite, Left and Right
The Oligarchs shun an honest fight
Bring the fight right to their door
And the Oligarchy will be no more
Yes, religiosity that also promotes falsehoods such as the Earth being flat or that creationism is the only way. It's very scary.
Bernie being a populist leader should understand the problem as well as anybody. Just as it would be difficult for Bernie to go against his political base, think supporting Hillary Clinton for president, it is difficult for Trump. Trump's populist political base has heard right wing lies for years and accepts those lies as the truth. Much of his base is also racist and part of it is anti-semiitic. To maintain political power Trump has to lie. If he stopped lying his base would claim he sold out to the establishment. Having elected Trump the US is simply stuck with the lying problem for four years, if Trump isn't impeached and removed from office. Elections have consequences. In this case very serious consequences.
When lies don't even pass the State Department test of containing "plausible deniability," but instead reek of false, egotistic, fabrication from a U.S. President, then those who don't call a spade a spade are complicit in the lie.
YES! We are all One Movement; and We must continue with La Lucha, the Struggle, at all times, in all ways non-violent, and at all levels! And Yes, rump is mentally unstable...insane, he Must be removed, far away from the nuke button!
Agree with Bernie.
As to calls (here and elsewhere) for Don's removal, does anyone see that happening any time soon, if at all?
There's either invocation of the 25th Amendment, or impeachment.
Once again, the Republican Party has shown its (ever truer) colors by the smash and grab philosophy of Bannon, Don, Ryan and the Cabinet appointees,et al.
Ironic that only the Republican pols can (try to) avert what could easily become WWIII.
Remind him that the American people overwhelmingly want him to release his tax returns.
Remind him again.
Drive him (more) bonkers with the frequency of the reminders.
Optional: Mention that this is of such great interest because he is so generally perceived as a liar.
Ask him if embarrassing conflicts-of-interest involving Russians are why he is so afraid of releasing his tax returns.