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When Money Talks, Climate Solutions Die


#1

When Money Talks, Climate Solutions Die

Derek Cressman

Californians are rightfully proud that we have led the country in establishing a cap and trade system to reduce carbon emissions and set up a renewable energy portfolio requirement that has us on track to generate 33% of our electricity from non-greenhouse gas sources by 2020.


#2

Great point. Why aren't the votes of legislators public? All the time - every time? How can they claim to represent people if people don't know how they vote on bills? Too much in our 'democracy' is undemocratic and elitist. Of the people, By the people and For the people... is not behind closed doors or voice only votes. We should know how our representatives vote on everything they vote for. Always.


#3

This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.


#4

Has anyone ever traced the origin of using a rat's ass as a unit of measurement or even as a mean's of calculating significance? Did people way back when trade in the hind parts of rats and establish an acceptable value to them. And who actually kept giving people a rat's ass in exchange for something.

People say "I wouldn't give a rat's ass for ..." Does that mean that they intend to keep the one they already have and maybe save it for later? Do people have several at home? What happened to the rest of the rat btw?

I can affirm that even when someone says they wouldn't give a rat's ass ...that I wouldn't accept it anyway and personally consider the whole business transaction unsanitary and would recommend the other person wash their hands immediately.

And who started that whole maiming rabbits thing too? Why are there so many rabbits with only three feet hopping around? Rabbit's feet are very unlucky for rabbits and probably exact a horrendous Karmic debt across several reincarnations! It is likely that Buddha did not carry around a rabbit's foot for luck... Just saying'!!!

I hope this helped Cookies... :innocent:


#5

Perhaps it is just that a "rat's ass" is something so utterly useless, that one would never keep one.
* When I was a kid, the phrase "not worth a Continental" was still used to describe something utterly worthless. (I've never tried it, but you youngsters could probably Google it and get a bit of the history behind it.)
* But I think all of this pro and con malarky we are hearing and seeing is not worth a Continental. Bullshit should be used to fertilize the fields.
* Ultimately, I think Mother Nature is coming, and boy is she pissed!
;-})


#6

Now you know why I never became a comedian...lol


#7

So, here's the thing. For about the last two an half weeks, I have been in a funk. Now, don't get me wrong, because before that, I was in a ? ....well, okay, in the last two and a half weeks, I have been in a morass and a funk. This is because, I had a feelin'.... about how it really seemed time for the "regular " climate scientists, (and not just Guy McPhereson and Paul Beckwith) to come clean with WHEThER OR NOT we are in abrupt climate change or NOT. So, as everyone can see, there have been a "shift" in that many more "every day" climate scientists are now "coming out" to say that "Hell yeah, we ARE in abrupt climate change."
I wonder what comes next.


#8

The world confronts outright greed head on. People will need to face the fact that that the fossil fuel industry, the oil producing countries and fossil fuel interests are not just in denial but that they know the effect they are having on the world and even so, they prefer to keep making the money.

Many progressives and others seem to think that if only reactionary interests could be persuaded that global warming is real and that time is short that these powerful people would all just voluntarily give up producing and selling oil.

They all know we should get off oil. They also know it is damaging the world. They know but they just don't want to stop making the money. Shocking huh? A thief steals your money - he knows it is wrong - but he still wants to keep your money because he doesn't care about it being wrong or that it hurts your life etc. Like a criminal they know what they are doing is wrong but they don't care. They just want to keep making the money.

You asked what comes next?

The battle between those that care and those that don't.

People will find that oil interests will start getting nasty as they get more and more desperate as they see that they lost the keep using oil forever war.

First they tried to deny the need to get off oil by denying global warming. Now they will try to delay getting off oil as long as possible - stretching it out now that they see that they have lost the denial wars. Now comes the endless delays and the 'be reasonable we can't just stop using it all at once' bullcrap of the delay wars.

They know the change is inevitable but that doesn't mean that they will voluntarily get us off oil.


#9

Money can't talk. It's a completely faith based concept. Those pieces of paper -- whether they be currency, stock and bond certificates are only worth what people believe they're worth.

Even gold and jewels are not worth what people think. Gold is rare but if someone had enough food and water to sustain them through an extended crisis (such as the one the human population is currently experiencing) and someone wheeled up a wheelbarrow full of gold, platinum, emeralds, and pearls and offered to hand it over in exchange for all the life support essentials, would that be a good deal?


#10

I know, you are right. 'specially about the "battle between those who care and those who don't". ....So, Also, those that made it rich from fossil fuels.... even when or if they give 'em up.....will not want to let go of the POWER that they have usurped all these decades. So, they WILL try to configure the world into something that still allows them that POWER.... They will DO ANYTHING for that.


#11

I think that you are exactly right about that. They only love fossil fuels for the money not because of some love for oil. That's why they want these large scale solar furnace power plants and solar farms which are huge operations instead of local small scale plants and personal home use solar energy and wind.

The government could have created a huge solar power initiative (especially in the sunny southwest but instead it leans towards building huge solar projects. That makes them just like a coal fired plant in terms of charging money for electricity except they are not using coal or gas etc.

I love the big solar plants (L. A. should have a bunch.) but they'd be better if everybody's house and building had solar roofs and solar aluminum siding etc.

Yeah I agree they don't give a damn about doing what is necessary to help the world. They care only about keeping their pockets filled to overflowing.


#12

As related by a prior NON-corporatist Supreme Court Justice (Brandeis): A society can have extreme concentrations of wealth OR Democracy; but not both.

Thank you for pointing this out, Mr. Cressman:

"Some pundits would have us believe that the massive imbalance of paid speech is just fine, so long as it's all properly disclosed (as it appears to have been in this case.) But can any of us make wise decisions when we hear five times more from one side in a debate than another?"

Likely the vast majority of decisions that have a direct impact on public health, environmental sustainability, budgetary priorities, and so much else... few to none ever get to be vetted through public referendums. Mostly, the Big Money defines the agenda both off and on the voting rolls.


#13

Clever, but also likely a corporately-funded trick for taking readers' attention off of the actual topic of the article.


#14

Oh, yes, they will try to keep energy as a central distribution system... but, I wasn't just talkin about energy when I spoke of them trying to hang onto power and what they are willing to do to keep it. No, No..... they will re vamp our governing system in other ways so as to keep the balance of power tipped in their direction... so far that is will be leaning over and almost nothing left for the rest of us. I can see where they will revamp to the point that we won't even recognize our system, lacking though it is.... there is a lot coming down the pike. I can feel it.


#15

It is called humor and you ...YOU ...want to talk about going off topic. Sure okay SR, let's stay on topic from now on in your posts okay. You wouldn't want to be a hypocrite would you? So I am sure you will show us how to stay on topic. That will be so nice and we will learn so much.

As far as the corporate funded trick? I wonder about you sometimes SR. I think your mental state is worrisome and paranoid. You are humorless and estranged - all symptomatic of a disengaged emotional state. I wish you could just say what you do without all this attempted oneupmanship based on your paranoid assessment of other people's motives.

To say it plain SR. While sometimes trolls and shills favoring one issue or another come in here to mess with people, most people in CD are just people who share various points of view on the world. You aren't the only one SR. You aren't the only pure one, the only true one, the only one that can be trusted to be what you say you are.

Somehow a bit of humor is to you a sign of a corporate funded trick to go off subject. Like I have never spoken on this subject (and what I've said certainly doesn't fit your assessment of me) yet you make no connections. Do you forget? I'm here far too much ... as much as you even... you either have a memory lapse condition or you are just unable to discern the truth of people anymore. I suspect the latter because you are so remote from people, they all seem suspicious to you.

I have a solution. I suggest welcoming the trolls and shills and have a tilt at them in the stocks of debate. Any troll or shill is an easy mark to oppose and then you can let loose your feelings about what they say.

But stop guessing at what people are because you get it wrong so much. Speak your piece and if they oppose you directly then have a go at them. Don't seek them out with unfounded accusations like this. How absurd for you to think that a little bit of humor is so significant, so important! Also that commenting in any online forum is so desperately important too. Write an article and if what you have to say is important enough then it will be published. If it isn't then face facts.

I wrote it to another poster and I hope it made them smile. I did it because they have made me smile a number of times. Oh do forgive me for being a person SR and next time I promise to put in a request for your permission to be myself and have some fun.


#16

I think I know what you mean. Yes the the world is heading towards a place where it has never been in humanity's history. 8 billion (approx.) people by the end of this decade only 5 years away. Another decade and it will be 9 billion. Add in resource scarcity from food to water and dying oceans and climate change (maybe even climate catastrophe) and yeah you wonder what the mega rich - the mega powerful have going on to deal with that kind of world?

I don't know and some times when I see all the preparations for fascism being put into place, I worry. But sigh I worry only in the abstract, friend. I am not all that long for this world and that is the fact. Death is annoying (especially if you had season tickets).

I think though that we have a chance. I really do. Bernie is not a fake, not a typical politician. He is a man who has supported the people and not served the oligarchs all his life. I think he wants to make for himself a place in the history books as a truly progressive force that saved the American democracy from an oligarchic coup. He won't fix it all but he'll pave the way for it to be fixed over time. We need that. If Bernie doesn't get in then I think the rightwing/oligarchy will cement their gains and I have only pity for what the future we will have lost because of it.

So as yet I am hopeful and assuming (as it is looking like it will be) that Bernie gets in, I will get excited. Lol... it may not look like I am excited to others but nevertheless... lol. Let's just say I won't be dancing in the streets but I will be sitting around and tapping my feet happily.

I really am hopeful. I got yelled at by one of my progeny who had been enthused by Obama while I was not. I hated being right that time. This time I am enthused by this election and it is the first time in my life btw, I hope I am right this time, Bernie's record does it for me... I was never one for promises and always one for people's records.


#17

Because neither the legislators nor the corporations who own them, nor the profit-oriented media want the votes to be public. It would make it harder to screw the public, steal money form the poor and middle class and exercise their ever-increasing power.

Or was that a rhetorical question?


#18

Yeah it was rhetorical so basically I agree with what you said. I guess I should have said "Why are they still being kept secret by our legislators." Or something like that. I am pointing out that in a representative democracy we have a right to know how are representatives are voting. When they keep the way they vote on issues secret, that is inviting abuse. Why do they even need to keep their votes secret from the public they are supposed to be representing?


#19

More rhetorical bits, I guess. Obviously, we have only the rights we take; and it's just as obviously not a representative anything, or any kind of democracy. We all know that. Or at least most of us do; in the last week I've had discussions with 2 people who claimed to be completely unaware that the US wasn't the shining light of the world, helping all and with only the best intentions in all situations. Clearly, they need treatment but are only willing to work their problems out on the internet where there's no hope of it helping either them or us.